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Thread: PVC pipe for Infinity Kappa Door Enclosures? HELP |
    
Kyle Allen Unregistered guest |
| Posted on Sunday, June 19, 2005 - 05:37 pm: |
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I heard that using 6 inch pvc pipe in my doors with the backs closed off with mdf or birchwood would increase the quality of sound in my door speaker midbass, as well as protect the speakers from rain, snow, etc. Is this true? If so, then how do you properly mount the pvc pipe so that it will stay in the door. Thanks, |
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Gold Member Username: Carguy
Post Number: 3321
Registered: Nov-04
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| Posted on Sunday, June 19, 2005 - 06:59 pm: |
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Measure the depth of your doors before cutting pvc pipe. Then use sealing glue and screws for the enclosure.
Purchase "L" brackets so that you can mount the enclosure onto the door panel. Don't forget to dip the screws in the glue before tightening on the pvc pipe. Without that, the screws will make a hole on th pvc pipe and let the air escape. |
Kyle Allen Unregistered guest |
| Posted on Monday, June 20, 2005 - 09:38 am: |
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How big should the pvc pipe be? Is 6 inch enough? What does this actually do to the sound of the speakers? Where did you find the 6 inch? All I have been able to find at the supply stores is 4 inch. Thanks for the information. |
Gold Member Username: Carguy
Post Number: 3328
Registered: Nov-04
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| Posted on Monday, June 20, 2005 - 10:11 am: |
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You need to visit your local plumbing store. They're the only ones that will carry anything wider than 4".
PVC pipe with sound deadening material inside will give you very tight response for more accurate sound reproduction.
For 6.5" speaksers, 6" pvc will almost be a perfect fit. |
Kyle Allen Unregistered guest |
| Posted on Monday, June 20, 2005 - 10:23 am: |
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Okay. Did you insulate the pipe with dynamat like material or did you use the spray on or brush on material like edead v3. Also, did you make the backing with mdf, birchwood??? Do you need to drill holes for air ventilation? What will happen if I don't have enough door room? Will the speakers sound flat? What glue or sealant did you use for the pvc. Thanks for the advice. Do you have any pictures of your enclosures? |
Gold Member Username: Carguy
Post Number: 3329
Registered: Nov-04
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| Posted on Monday, June 20, 2005 - 10:36 am: |
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I used a sound deadening material similar to the ones inside home speaker. Pollyfill will do great also.
If you're going to try pollyfill, then spray adheasive material inside the pvc before stuffing it.
For the back, use mdf and speaker connectors. Make sure everything is glued and air tight.
I used a glue called goop that bonds and seals as well as screws dipped in glue to hold the mdf in place.
The whole purpose of air tight enclosure is to not have any vents.
If you have standard doors, then it should give you almost 4" of depth to play with. It just takes lot of time and labour.
I don't have any pictures cause it's already sealed and screwed on.
If you're not into high SQ, then it might not be worth your time. The outcome however is well worth the investment. |
Kyle Allen Unregistered guest |
| Posted on Monday, June 20, 2005 - 11:01 am: |
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How much poly fill do you use. Do you glue it to the inside of the walls or let it flow into the middle. Thanks for the help. I'm sure this will sound great when it's done. Could you really tell a difference in sound in your car? Thanks, |
Gold Member Username: Carguy
Post Number: 3330
Registered: Nov-04
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| Posted on Monday, June 20, 2005 - 11:19 am: |
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You glue it to the inside of the walls. I'd say around 1" thick, and be generous.
If the enclosure is done right, and with a high quality amp, it'll sound a step closer to being "live".
You have to have a sound that you listen to often. Then listen again with the new enclosure. You should be able to pick up much more chrisp sound, especially the fast drums.
Remember, with SQ, you can't do half a$$ job and expect great results. You either do it properly or don't do it at all. There is no in between.
One way to test air tight seal is to try and move the cone with your finger after it's installed. It should be rock solid. If it moves easily, then you have a bad seal. |
Kyle Allen Unregistered guest |
| Posted on Monday, June 20, 2005 - 11:24 am: |
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Thanks, Isaac. Could you check on this post in a few days. I'm sure I may have additional question if you have the time. I'm installing my whole system this week. Thanks again for all of the advice. |
Gold Member Username: Carguy
Post Number: 3332
Registered: Nov-04
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| Posted on Monday, June 20, 2005 - 11:27 am: |
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No problem. I will check, good luck. |
Kyle Allen Unregistered guest |
| Posted on Monday, June 20, 2005 - 02:30 pm: |
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Isaac, one more question before I attempt the install. Did you do the same procedure to the rear speakers or did you even use 6.5 in the rear. I'm contemplating using them as well, or I may just purchase some 6x8 for mid filler. Just thought I would ask. Thanks again, |
Gold Member Username: Carguy
Post Number: 3334
Registered: Nov-04
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| Posted on Monday, June 20, 2005 - 02:52 pm: |
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I have 2 pairs of 6.5" components in my front doors. So that has made the rears obsolete. I use the 6x9" holes as a bass port. It works quite nicely.
Unless you have enclosures for the rears, it's not worth having 6x9s at the back. The cones on them cracked under constant pressure from the sub. |
Kyle Allen Unregistered guest |
| Posted on Monday, June 20, 2005 - 03:05 pm: |
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What components do you use? I have infinity kappa perfects 6.1. You said you have two pair...(kick panel and door)?? Do you think I should mount them in the rear as well if I create the enclosures? Thanks, |
Gold Member Username: Carguy
Post Number: 3335
Registered: Nov-04
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| Posted on Monday, June 20, 2005 - 03:24 pm: |
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I have Polk Momo and Diamond Audio 6.5" components. They both serve different purpose. One near the kick panel is for mids, the one on the door is mid bass (pvc enclosure).
If you can make the pvc fit in the rears and you want music for the rear passengers, then yes.
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Kyle Allen Unregistered guest |
| Posted on Monday, June 20, 2005 - 03:33 pm: |
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Is it good to mix speakers. Possibly mixing the infinity kappa perfects with Polk momo mm6. (the polks were my second choice but I had not heard them in person so I was afraid to purchase them) Have you ran the tweeter for both or just one set of tweeters up front. Sorry for all of the questions. I have done several smaller installations but nothing as detailed as this one. I just want to get it right. Thanks again. |
Gold Member Username: Carguy
Post Number: 3336
Registered: Nov-04
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| Posted on Monday, June 20, 2005 - 03:45 pm: |
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I have 3 sets of tweeters, one from Polk, Diamond Audio, and 1 hard tweeter for super chrisp highs. My tweeters are installed near the mids to improve the sound imaging. Those 2 pair of tweeters from the components, are not producing same sound. One of them is for softer highs, while the diamond is configured to produce a bit sharper notes. The hard tweeter is there for crystal clear highs. They are all balanced so that, no one tweeter is over powering the other.
Sound is similar to painting. You can combine 2 or more speakers to produce the desired effect.
Don't try and do everything at once, you'll just go crazy. |
Kyle Allen Unregistered guest |
| Posted on Monday, June 20, 2005 - 04:57 pm: |
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So would a silk tweeter and a titanium tweeter blend well together depending on there positioning? I see what you saying about the painting. :-) I'm just a little eager. I haven't installed a good system since high school so I'm eager to get it in and tweak it. |
Gold Member Username: Carguy
Post Number: 3341
Registered: Nov-04
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| Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2005 - 09:17 am: |
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If they didn't blend in, you can always make it fit. Positioning is very important. It can improve or kill the SQ and imaging. So before you screw anything down, use double sided tape and play with it. |
Kyle Allen Unregistered guest |
| Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2005 - 02:59 pm: |
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Isaac, you stated above that putting 6x9's in the back would be useless without enclosures. Would you say the same about a second pair of 6.1 kappas? Thanks, |
Gold Member Username: Carguy
Post Number: 3352
Registered: Nov-04
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| Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2005 - 03:56 pm: |
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Well in my situation, the sub was over powering the 6x9s as well as shaking the cone too much. It eventually cracked it.
So I'd put it in an enclosure or skip it. Don't believe the ads that claim 6x9 can handle 400w+. If you're lucky, it'll handle 100w without cracking. 6.5" are the way to go for SQ and power.
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Kyle Allen Unregistered guest |
| Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2005 - 04:15 pm: |
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Would the sub do similar damage to a 6.5 place in the rear deck or should I leave them out? |
Gold Member Username: Carguy
Post Number: 3355
Registered: Nov-04
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| Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2005 - 04:29 pm: |
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Unless your sub and amp is over 1200w rms I wouldn't worry too much. My 6x9s were almost under the sub anyways, so it couldn't handle the pounding.
You should be fine. |
Kyle Allen Unregistered guest |
| Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2005 - 04:45 pm: |
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My subs will be running 500 watts rms a piece, so hopefully it won't cause any problems. I will definitely go with the 6.5's though. Thanks for all of the advice. I can't wait to get to work on this tomorrow. |
Kyle Allen Unregistered guest |
| Posted on Wednesday, June 22, 2005 - 09:17 am: |
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Okay, I've officially ran into my first problem. My door panels have the railing for the power window partially in the path of my speaker. I just hope I can fit the damn thing in the door now. I'm unsure if I can even get the PVC into the door. Any suggestions on getting around this problem? I'm going to have to get some measurements on the speakers to see if they will even fit in the doors. I know that they will somehow because I have been in mustang with them in, but it should be fun. How deep does the pvc pipe have to be in order to work successfully? Maybe I can notch around the bar and seal it back up. Thanks, |
Gold Member Username: Carguy
Post Number: 3363
Registered: Nov-04
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| Posted on Wednesday, June 22, 2005 - 09:53 am: |
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Lower the window and then measure the depth. Then leave 1/4" for the speaker wires and safety.
Now measure the distance between the door panel and the door cover. Those 2 numbers should give you enough info on the actual size of the pvc.
It is not the end of the world, if the pvc have to protrude a bit out. You can always cut a 6" hole on the door cover and then put the grill afterwards. A little bit of fiberglass/body molding and paint will do wonders. Anything can be made to fit. Just takes some imagination and time. |
New member Username: Dr_sharp
USA
Post Number: 2
Registered: Jun-05
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| Posted on Wednesday, June 22, 2005 - 08:50 pm: |
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Isaac I have a feeling your case is very rare. I have absolutely no problems with my 6x9s and sub. I thought that I would have problems with the pressure of the sub pounding into the back of the 6x9s but there is none. So long as you use xovers to keep from overlapping frequencies you'll be fine (unless you've got 1200Wrms subs lol). I wouldn't give the advice you've given in this thread as general advice, but I'm sure you know what you're talking about.
What brand of speakers did you have that couldn't handle the power or the pressure? |
Bronze Member Username: Littleguy
Post Number: 44
Registered: Dec-04
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| Posted on Saturday, June 25, 2005 - 12:51 pm: |
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Isaac, would the pvc work for a 4" midrange in the door or would i just need to make a wood baffle? Thanks Isaac:} |
Gold Member Username: Carguy
Post Number: 3395
Registered: Nov-04
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| Posted on Sunday, June 26, 2005 - 12:42 pm: |
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I don't think it's worth the trouble for a 4" midrange. You'd be better off with a baffle.
4" doesn't produce enough bass to warrant a pvc enclosure. |
New member Username: Kyle_allen
Post Number: 1
Registered: Jun-05
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| Posted on Sunday, June 26, 2005 - 03:14 pm: |
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Isaac, what is the minimum size for the pipe enclosure you would use for the kappas. I don't want them to sound bad because of an enclosure that is too small. Thanks.
Kyle |
Bronze Member Username: Littleguy
Post Number: 50
Registered: Dec-04
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| Posted on Sunday, June 26, 2005 - 03:48 pm: |
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I already made them. It wouldn't work on the Utopia's as the cones aren't attached to the speaker paper itself. Well, it's not paper but u know what i mean, lol. It still made an encloser, baffle, lol. |
Bronze Member Username: Littleguy
Post Number: 51
Registered: Dec-04
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| Posted on Sunday, June 26, 2005 - 03:51 pm: |
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I put speaker cloth around the pvc, it turned out pretty nice actually. |
Gold Member Username: Carguy
Post Number: 3398
Registered: Nov-04
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| Posted on Monday, June 27, 2005 - 08:50 am: |
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Minimum as in diameter or depth? I'd use 6" and 4" in depth at least with sound deadening material inside. |
Bronze Member Username: Littleguy
Post Number: 53
Registered: Dec-04
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| Posted on Monday, June 27, 2005 - 02:22 pm: |
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What are u saying, to use 6" round pvc and make a baffle for the 4" speaker? |
Gold Member Username: Carguy
Post Number: 3408
Registered: Nov-04
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| Posted on Monday, June 27, 2005 - 02:24 pm: |
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No, 6" pvc pipe is the minimum size I would use for an enclosure. For 4", use a baffle, but if you already made one, then use it. |
New member Username: Kyle_allen
Post Number: 2
Registered: Jun-05
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| Posted on Monday, June 27, 2005 - 02:33 pm: |
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Steve, He was responding to my question regarding the depth for infinity kappa perfect 6.1 (6.5 inches). I need a minimum of 4 inch depth for it to sound good. You should check and see what fits best around your 4", but I would have to agree with Isaac that the woofer won't produce enough bass to merit the time and effort. But if you are still going to do I I would look into 3 to 3.5 inch for you pvc. You need to measure the back and see what fits. |
Bronze Member Username: Littleguy
Post Number: 54
Registered: Dec-04
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| Posted on Monday, June 27, 2005 - 02:58 pm: |
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I see, lol..... Sorry man:} How are u making out Kyle? |
New member Username: Kyle_allen
Post Number: 3
Registered: Jun-05
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| Posted on Monday, June 27, 2005 - 03:07 pm: |
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Getting ready for the install. I took out my entire interior and put down edead v1se everywhere 120 sqft and 1 gallon v3. Running the wires today. I finally found some 6 inch pvc pipe through a local dealer. Lowes, menards, do not carry that large. I should have it done in two days. I'll post again when I have it in. |
Bronze Member Username: Dr_sharp
USA
Post Number: 17
Registered: Jun-05
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| Posted on Monday, June 27, 2005 - 06:33 pm: |
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how much did that pipe cost? |
Gold Member Username: Carguy
Post Number: 3419
Registered: Nov-04
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| Posted on Monday, June 27, 2005 - 09:28 pm: |
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$34 for 10' of 6" pvc pipe from a plumbing store. |
Bronze Member Username: Riebread77
Post Number: 100
Registered: Jun-05
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| Posted on Wednesday, June 29, 2005 - 12:36 pm: |
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take pictures through the course of the install and post on here if you could. I would like to try the same, but a visual would be very helpful. Thanks. |
New member Username: Kyle_allen
Post Number: 4
Registered: Jun-05
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| Posted on Thursday, June 30, 2005 - 03:21 pm: |
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i'll have to see if I can find a digital camera. It's my first time doing this, so with Isaac's help it should be okay. I'm just winging it. |
Bronze Member Username: Littleguy
Post Number: 55
Registered: Dec-04
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| Posted on Friday, July 15, 2005 - 11:05 pm: |
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Kyle, how did you make out with your project? |
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| Posted on Saturday, July 16, 2005 - 10:51 am: |
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let's try this,
go to your local plumbing supply house,purchase (2) five inch hard caps,a 6.5 inch speaker will fit inside perfectly.All you have to do is cut down the cap to the desired depth.just make sure that you measure from the inside of the cap..I drilled a small hole in the back of the cap for the wire to go through then used polyseamseal caulking to fill the void. I used a two part epoxy to secure the mounting ring to the cap, then used more polyseamseal to make sure that no air could escape.I have mounted several speakers this way, I made a pair of kick panels out of the 5" hard caps, the pvc can be painted, fiberglassed, carpeted, the possibilities are endless..
I'm thinkin my next project will be a dual 10" sub enclosure made from two ten inch pvc hardcaps |
