Archive through October 05, 2007

Bronze Member

Username: Edenney

Post Number: 20
Registered: Jun-07

Posted on Thursday, August 16, 2007 - 06:51 am:

F Navarro,

Although the major warranty is only 1 year on Sony TVs, the warranty on the optical block/light engine is 2 years for all of their projection TVs to the best of my knowledge (all the ones I've looked at are 2 years). Please look at your warranty card or download one from Sony's website and confirm this, but I'm 99% certain your model will have a 2 year warranty on that part.

You did not provide any description of your problem though, so I have no way of knowing if it's the optical block or not. I presume that it must be at least some sort of discoloration since you were asked to move your speakers away from the TV. I'm very familiar with the effects of magnets on televisions and the result is in fact similar to the early stages of the "blue blob" issue (although it's usually pink), but to the best of my knowledge magnets only affect tube televisions in this manner, not rear projection or LCDs, but I'm not 110% certain of this. In any event, your speakers would have had to have been extremely close, typically about 6" or less for normal A/V speakers, for them to have caused interference in any TV, and then only if the speakers weren't shielded.

Anyway, if what you're seeing on your TV is the "blue blob" issue, or even another color such as pink or yellow, and it looks similar to the many, many pictures posted in this forum, then it's a very safe bet it's the same optical block defect. Without looking back at this forum I'm not sure that I've seen anyone with your model report this problem, I thought perhaps it had been resolved prior to that, but it's certainly possible.

Like I said, the good news is that if it's the Optical Block, and that will require having a Sony authorized service representative look at it to 100% confirm this, the parts and labor will be completely covered up until 2 years from the date of purchase and the repairs will be done within 30 days. The other good news is that that's the most expensive part on the TV as far as I know, most everything else is much cheaper to repair/replace. So, although any other part would be out of warranty, you're most likely not looking at a $1200-$1500 repair.

To start with, please confirm the exact nature of your problem and post some pictures so that others can compare them to problems we've seen or experienced. After that we'll be better able to point you in the right direction.

Eric

P.S. In the future please be sure to purchase an extended warranty if you ever purchase a rear projection, LCD or Plasma. Especially the rear projections since they require lamps which are typically covered under the extended warranties and their cost alone will pay for the warranty. The technology in all of these TVs is still rather new and repairs are much more expensive than good old tube televisions. Like most of us this was probably your first HDTV purchase and you didn't know any better. I for one, after having had major repairs done to both my Sony rear projection and my Sony LCD, both within 24 months of purchase, will always purchase extended warranties for these in the future.

Joey Skinner

New member

Username: Jskinner

Post Number: 5
Registered: Jun-07

Posted on Thursday, August 16, 2007 - 07:40 am:

F Navarro, you wrote: "I've been contemplating on writing a nasty complaint letter..."
I know you are upset but I think you'll get better results by writing a very nice letter. First you need to get the problem diagnosed by an authorized Sony tech. If you didn't get an event# when you called customer service you need to do that. If/when they tell you your set is not covered by the extended service, write a nice letter to the Sony Executive Review Committee. There are a couple of examples on this page. In my case Sony responded very quickly with a favorable outcome for me.

Jim Johnson

New member

Username: Jimjohn1213

Post Number: 1
Registered: Aug-07

Posted on Thursday, August 16, 2007 - 09:12 am:

Have been reading this board for about two months. A lot of great info.

I have a KF 42WE610 that I purchased in July 2004. The blue blob, plus about 500 stuck blue pixels, running down the center of the screen initally showed up in November 2006. I bought the set from Circuit City and did purchase a two-year extended warranty - which is a rip off because it run concurrent with the Sony warranty.

Began researching on the web and found that Sony has extended the warranty for my set for the squiggly line or readmap problem. Had the set diagnosed by authorized Sony repair shop in early December 2006 and open a ticket with Sony. By the end of December had reached a stalemate with Sony. No help at all since problem was not roadmap even though optical block needed to be replaced.

Fast forward to this month. Found this thread which lead me back to the Sony site to discover the extended warranty for 2004 sets with blue blob problem. However KF 42WE610 is not covered but KF 42WE620 is covered. Using the address I found here I wrote a nice letter to the Executive Review Committee. Described the previous attempts in December to get help from Sony. Then pointed out that from what I could tell, researching on the Sony site, the only difference between the KF 42WE610 and the KF 42WE620 is that the former was only sold in the U.S. and the latter in Canada.

Received a call from Sony 3 days after I mailed the letter. I had to take the set back to an autorized dealer for diagnostics which confirmed it is the optical black. Sony agreed to pick up $890 of the $1300 repair cost. Could probably have gotten Sony to cover more but am happy with the offer. The repair is happening now and I should have the set back by the weekend.

So for everyone out there is still fighting, keep it up. Seems persistance is the key.

Thanks again for all the info folks have contributed to the board.

F Navarro

New member

Username: Sonyboy

Post Number: 2
Registered: Aug-07

Posted on Thursday, August 16, 2007 - 01:30 pm:

Thanks for the quick post Eric/Joey. Sorry, I wasn't specific enough to my problem earlier. I started seeing the pink stain around two months ago. I thought it was temporary problem, but just like everybody else, the pink stain has been part of my screen now whenever we watch TV. Sony folks pretty much told me that there's nothing else they could do but to recommend to replace the LCD, which would probably cost me a lot of $$.

I don't remember seeing a warranty card that says two years or so but the typical one year. Since you guys are more knowledgeable than me, then I would take your suggestion and send Sony a nice letter(Thanks Joey).

I've attached 2 pics, so please let me know if I really have a case on a possible optical block problem. I took it earlier this morning on a white screen background.

Thanks guys!

Upload

Bronze Member

Username: Edenney

Post Number: 21
Registered: Jun-07

Posted on Thursday, August 16, 2007 - 02:10 pm:

F Navarro,

Your pictures certainly don't reflect something that was the result of having your speakers too close to the TV, even IF they could affect rear projection TVs which I don't think they would, at least not like they affect tube TVs.

Your pictures could very well be the result of the blue or pink blob problem, but if so it's at a very advanced stage. it's hard to really tell from these pictures, it doesn't look quite like the typical blob pictures most people post, but that doesn't mean much. Please describe how the problem started and how it progressed, and over what period of time.

Most commonly, the problem starts with a slight discoloration at the very bottom of the TV, usually toward the corner, and slowly progresses along the bottom of the TV until it reaches the opposite end. From there it starts growing upward and outward, and may start to come from a new point of origin on the screen as well. Eventually, the entire picture will be covered although usually some areas are more deeply discolored than others. In my experience, it generally takes 6-8 weeks from first appearance before it's pretty much covering the entire screen.

I've attached pictures of most recent blue blob problem for comparison, this was at a very advanced stage after about 6 weeks, and taken against a gray background. All that remains of the original gray background is a very small spot in the upper left and right corners.

The process I described doesn't happen exactly the same for everyone and as I mentioned previously the color can sometimes be pink or even yellow. The discoloration might start at a different point on the TV and progress in a different direction, but the process itself is generally the same. I think the orientation of the LCD panels and their placement relative to the cooling element inside the optical block, may well have a lot to do with what color you see and where the discoloration starts and how it progresses. Since the optical block design varies from one model to the next, this accounts for the variation in how the problem manifests itself.

By the way, I looked up the warranty card for your TV and it does state 2 years for the "color picture tube", which is their screwed up terminology for the optical block or light engine. There is no color picture tube on a rear projection TV, and if you look at the more recent warranty cards in the last couple years for the same but slightly newer model rear projection TVs, the warranty cards specify 2 years on the optical block instead of the color picture tube. Clearly it was a typo on their part but it means the same thing.

The typo will create a little more hassle for you when you try to get the repairs covered, but all you have to do is show them the more recent warranty cards (available on Sony's website) which have the correct terminology on the same but newer model TV, and point out there there is no "color picture tube" in a rear projection. In any event, as long as it's the optical block, and it surely is based on your pictures, you're covered for 2 years from date of purchase no matter what the problem is (blue blob, roadmapping, etc.). However, I believe that after 1 year only the part is covered, and you still have to pay for the labor which should run around $300-$400 (the optical block alone runs around $900 usually).
Upload

Bronze Member

Username: Slinke

Post Number: 14
Registered: May-07

Posted on Thursday, August 16, 2007 - 02:55 pm:

F Navarro, Eric Denney, et al.

1. I think there is some confusion about Sony's base warranties on their rear-projection TVs based on the fact that there are at least three different warranty cards, and they all cover multiple TVs, apparently including some non-rear-projection models. For example, warranty card "4-557-168-03" applies to F Navarro's KDF-E60A20 rear-projection TV, as well as most of the other rear-projection models mentioned in this topic. It includes a 1-year parts and labor warranty with a 2-year warranty on the "color picture tube" part. The "optical block" on a rear-projection TV is essentially analogous to the "picture tube" on a conventional cathode-ray tube (CRT) TV, but rear-projection TVs do not have picture tubes.

One might conclude that the reference to the picture tube on these cards is an error, except that in the upper-right corner there is a list of TV types: HDTV, Color TV XBR, and Projection TV. The "Color TV XBR" likely refers to Sony's XBR-model CRT TVs that always had a longer 2-year warranty on their picture tubes compared to the 1-year warranty on the non-XBR CRT TVs. This warranty card also refers to 19" or larger screens being provided with in-home service, further supporting the theory that this generic warranty card applies to CRT TVs, as well as rear-projection models, since no rear-projection model would be that small.

Warranty card "4-094-133-01" which applies to another set of models, but is specific to rear-projection TVs, includes only 1-year parts and labor.

The exception is warranty card "2-887-485-01," which also refers only to rear-projection models, but only applies to the very newest SXRD models (KDS-##A20## and KDS-R##XBR2). It refers to the typical 1-year parts and labor warranty, but specifically refers to a 2-year warranty on the "projection optical block" part. Even in this case, though, the labor is not covered after one year, so the repair would likely cost $300-400.

You can enter your model number to find your official warranty card here:
http://esupport.sony.com/US/perl/select-system.pl?DIRECTOR=DOCS&PRODTYPE=34

2. The support person's reference to the speaker magnets seems like pure silliness. It is my understanding that on CRT TVs, placing magnets (such as those in speakers) close to the front of the screen can cause magnetization of a metal screen that normally helps guide the flying electrons to their proper colored phosphors on the inside face of the screen. This magnetization can bend the path of the flying electrons such that they activate the wrong colored phosphors, thereby causing discoloration in the area of the magnet.

However, as mentioned above, rear projection TVs don't use picture tubes that create electrons to activate color phosphors. They just project light onto a surface. Thus, magnets should not have any noticeable effect.

Based on the pictures posted by F Navarro, I think it is far more likely that his problem arises from dust in the optical block (like the small purple fingerprints described by others). In theory, the optical block is OK...it just needs a cleaning. In contrast, the blue blob and star patterns indicate physical damage to the LCD parts. I think people have had varying degrees of success with using compressed air to clean out the dust. The process to get to the optical block is the same as when replacing it, so it is not a simple task:
http://splinke.googlepages.com/sonyrearprojectionlcdtv-opticalblock

The design of these optical blocks that are open to flying dust stirred up by the fans is a bit mind-boggling.

Bronze Member

Username: Slinke

Post Number: 15
Registered: May-07

Posted on Thursday, August 16, 2007 - 03:01 pm:

Eric Denney and F Navarro,

Eric, I was preparing my above post while you were preparing yours, so some of the stuff is redundant. I think, though, that F Navarro's problem is that little pinkish thing in the middle of the screen--not the overall blue background, which is probably just an artifact of the photo or the background color he chose. Is that correct F Navarro? I think the pinkish/purplish spots are more indicative of dust.

New member

Username: 39791

Post Number: 9
Registered: May-07

Posted on Thursday, August 16, 2007 - 03:16 pm:

F Navarro,

I have the same problem only worse, it is pink, blue and yellow light colored spots, Lets start calling these thumb prints to distinguish our problem.

see my photos on Tuesday, July 31, 2007 - 05:55 pm:

I have the KDF50WE655, the problem that I have been running into is with the repair centers, like everyone else states they do not seem to be aware of the issue. After going through several different authorized centers, I finally lucked out with the store that originally sold me the unit.

Sony did not list them as Authorized. After speaking with the repair manager and telling him of my issues, he asked that I send the letter from Sony (the one we all got)he read it and stated that I would have to pay for the visit, but labor and parts will be provided by Sony if it is determined to be the optical block. He requested the event number, I contacted Sony and the C.R. told me that if it is determined to be the optical block even the service fee will be covered.

The biggest problem that I see is that the Authorized Service Centers are not up to speed with the issue. As the last C.R. I spoke with (1 of 50)
stated that the centers have the documentation to process the issues. I almost asked her to send me a copy so that I could give it to the repair shops. This would really make everyone�s life easier.

After seeing everyone getting their units fixed I believe that Sony will make this right for us.

They are coming out tomorrow I will post the findings, but in a nutshell if the person says its the optical block it will be covered 100%.

Eric

Bronze Member

Username: Edenney

Post Number: 22
Registered: Jun-07

Posted on Thursday, August 16, 2007 - 03:27 pm:

Guess I'm going to have to start signing my posts as "Eric D" now ;)

New member

Username: 39791

Post Number: 10
Registered: May-07

Posted on Thursday, August 16, 2007 - 04:00 pm:

My Bad Eric

Bronze Member

Username: Edenney

Post Number: 23
Registered: Jun-07

Posted on Thursday, August 16, 2007 - 04:15 pm:

No worries :-)

Bronze Member

Username: 39791

Post Number: 11
Registered: May-07

Posted on Friday, August 17, 2007 - 12:23 pm:

Pink/Purple/Blue Thumb Print on KDF50we655

Service Technician came out today, immediately looked at the set and said it was debris in the optical block; he also stated that he will need an authorization code from Sony in order to set up the repair. He mentioned that he would have to consult with the Sony Service group, and he said they are going to ask him if he cleaned the optical block, he will tell them no, as he said the block is not sealed (as noted in Steve Linke�s comments) he said that he will tell Sony that the customer understands that this is not going to remedy the cause and recommends that he changes the optical block.

The service tech. will call Sony on Monday to see how to proceed. Craig Smith posted the same issues as mine and was able to get credit for a new set. Seems to me that Sony has accepted his issue as an optical block problem, even though it does not fall under the Blob or road mapping.

Eric L

F Navarro

New member

Username: Sonyboy

Post Number: 3
Registered: Aug-07

Posted on Friday, August 17, 2007 - 01:07 pm:

Thanks for all the replies guys! I appreciate all the info. Yeah, Steve is right with the warranty--it's confusing. I've checked the website and compared my warrany card, and it's the same(1 year on both). Yes Steve, I chose a white background on my TV when I took the picture yesterday because that's the only way to notice the pink stain on the screen.

The other comment that kinda gave me hope a little bit is the dust part on the optical block. I think I could do it. Since my warranty had expired, I'll try it anyway. The only question is..how do I clean it? Do I use a vacuum or just a plain damp cloth? By the way, is this some kind of DIY type clean up, or should I just let the pros work on it?

Thanks for all the help guys!

Bronze Member

Username: Edenney

Post Number: 24
Registered: Jun-07

Posted on Friday, August 17, 2007 - 02:08 pm:

The problem with replacing the optical block to resolve a dust/debris problem, is that there's no reason to believe a new optical block will remedy the cause. Although whatever was causing the blue blob problem has allegedly been addressed in the new optical blocks, I've heard nothing to indicate that the flawed design, which allows debris to get into that delicate area, has been corrected. As long as that area is unsealed, people who have their TV in unusually dusty or smokey environments are going to continue to have problems over time (not blaming the owner for the environment, it's just an unfortunate fact).

Of course, I'd prefer to have a new Optical Block rather than just have mine cleaned any day of the week, then you know you're getting a 100% clean Optical Block. I think the fact that they've made design changes to remedy the blue blob problem in response to a well documented defect, provides a sufficient arguement that they MUST replace your Optical Block and not just clean it. If Sony tries to make them just clean your Optical Block to save them money, I'd bring this up and really push the issue. You've got all kinds of documentation and good talking points to back up your arguement.

Alternatively, if you have some extra cash or credit on hand, you might just want to use this opportunity to go ahead and get credit toward a new TV. The fact of the matter is that if you're having this problem, it's apparently due to the environment of the TV (coupled with the flawed design of course), and there's every reason to believe it will continue to happen every so often as debris builds up. Unless you want to have to keep dealing with this occasionally, you're going to have to get a new/different TV.

Bronze Member

Username: Slinke

Post Number: 16
Registered: May-07

Posted on Friday, August 17, 2007 - 02:23 pm:

I agree with Eric Denney.

And to answer your other question, I would not consider this a typical do-it-yourself project, but it is certainly possible for owners to dismantle their own TVs to get to the optical block. I have posted some pretty detailed pictures and procedures on my web site:
http://splinke.googlepages.com/sonyrearprojectionlcdtv-opticalblock

The only real tools you will need are a conventional Philips-head screwdriver and another Philips-head screwdriver with about a 10" shaft. The main thing is to be VERY careful, and to carefully note where the parts and specific screws go, and to carefully label any wires that must be disconnected. The pictures and instructions should help, but each model is a bit different, and there are a number of things that could go wrong.

A repair shop would probably charge about $350 to do this (the same labor charge as replacing it).

However, pretty much your only option once you get to the optical block is to blow compressed air into the opening that contains the LCD panels (you can see this in the pictures), and there is no guarantee that this will even work. I have heard varying reports of success--usually this is not successful. You may just redistribute the dust. And even if it does work, or at least makes it better, the problem is likely to return.

Frank Connors

New member

Username: Farmerpig

Post Number: 10
Registered: Jul-07

Posted on Friday, August 17, 2007 - 02:35 pm:

...My KDF-70XBR950 is now repaired..Thanks to Sony....The new optical block looks just like the old one, so the improvements they made are on the inside and not visible..I had dust, which burned up the LCD's...My tech who did the repairs said these TV's are really very good despite the optical block problems..He also said many other brands are having the same problems and are not being repaired by their companies...Sony is the only one to do out of warranty repairs or exchanges...My picture is now back to fabulous..I am happy Sony stepped up to the plate to correct this...At times they were a pain in the butt to deal with..I am feeling better about Sony, they did not let me down..I might buy something else from them now...Enjoy the pictures....

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I wish I could wear shorts to work!

FC

Thanks for all the info on this blog...I could have not done this without you!

Bronze Member

Username: Edenney

Post Number: 25
Registered: Jun-07

Posted on Friday, August 17, 2007 - 03:53 pm:

Frank C:

Congrats on getting your TV repaired, it's always so nice after having to deal with the blue blob for weeks or months. I haven't done any research about other manufacturer's TVs having similar problems, has anyone else out there heard anything about this or done any research about major problems with other manufacturer's rear projection TVs?

Thanks for the info about the apparently unchanged outward appearance of the optical block. I'm not overly surprised that any changes they made, if in fact they did make design changes as claimed, are not visible on the outside. The Optical Block has to fit into the exact same tight footprint which would severely limit any capacity for external changes. Best guess (and that's all it is) is that they changed the fan design, fan power, or altered the air flow in some manner to achieve a greater CFM and thus increase the cooling capacity. I think Sony would probably do their best to keep the change(s) under their hat, since by making the exact change known it would probably be obvious to most people that this was something that should have been caught and changed a long, long time ago.

That's a lot of dust on that part, is that the Optical Block or some other component? I presume it's the Optical block but it's impossible to tell with such a close up picture. I really wish I had asked the tech to let me take some detailed pictures of both my old and the new optical blocks when they recently repaired my TV, but unfortunately all I could think about at the time was having my TV fixed and like new again. If anybody out there is still waiting for their optical block to be replaced, it would be great if you could take several good pictures of both optical blocks when they effect the repairs. Try and get pictures from the same distance and angle of both parts so that a detailed comparison can be made.

Eric

Brett Fischer

New member

Username: Bfischer24

Post Number: 2
Registered: Jun-07

Posted on Friday, August 17, 2007 - 04:10 pm:

Well, after taking the advice here with Blue Blobs on my KF50WE610 bought in May of 2004 and writting and sending certified letters, calling customer service etc, I finally talked to a EC rep today about my Problem, which is still my problem because they are doing absolutely nothing.

I asked why is it that the same symptoms as the recently announced defective optical blocks in a similar models aren't covered, even though they have already declared my optical block defective for ANOTHER problem... he of course had no answer.

So i am giving up on Sony for good. Never again will I purchase a Sony product. I have been a loyal customer for several years, which ends today for good. I will also tell everyone who asks me (the so called A/V expert) to stay away from Sony. For $1200 in parts and labor they are losing a brand loyal customer and everyone who asks for my advice.

A $3400 TV that craps out after 3 years and the company won't stand behind their product? Terrible.

Has anyone else been denied by the EC and then have been helped? Or is this the end of the road?

Bronze Member

Username: Edenney

Post Number: 27
Registered: Jun-07

Posted on Friday, August 17, 2007 - 04:34 pm:

I've yet to see someone with this problem in a TV manufactured in 2003 or later not get a reasonable measure of satisfaction from Sony one way or another, you would be the first that I can recall. If you truly feel that you have exhausted all of your options, you still have the small claims option I have posted about at length at least twice on this board. Your case is about as strong as they come, and Sony will very likely settle or not show up anyway.

It's your money but if it were me that's definitely what I'd do after if I reached a dead end with the ERC and customer support. I'd write them one more time, documenting every owner of a KF50WE610 who has received a measure of satisfaction from Sony (just search all the past posts). It's hard for them to justify how they can compensate so many owners of the same TV with the same problem and not treat you the same. If that still fails I'd definitely spend a few bucks to file in small claims.

Bronze Member

Username: Slinke

Post Number: 17
Registered: May-07

Posted on Friday, August 17, 2007 - 05:15 pm:

The extremely dirty fan shown in Frank Connors' middle photo is the centrifugal fan that sits directly on top of the optical block. It is directly under the circular area of the gray part seen in the photo above it. This fan appears to suck air from the LCD panel area (on the right side of the top photo) and blow it down onto the lamp (lower-left of the top photo). That is a huge amount of dust, and it is not surprising that there was dust in the LCD area. You can see more detailed pictures (with a much cleaner centrifugal fan

) on my web site:
http://splinke.googlepages.com/sonyrearprojectionlcdtv-opticalblock

Regarding the owners of 2003 models who have, so far, been left out of the extended optical block warranty, another interesting thing to know would be whether the optical block part numbers are different for these models compared to the 2004 models. I started compiling information on this, but I abandon the project. Perhaps someone else has some of the information:

model = optical block part #
KDF42WE655 = A1084658A
KDF50WE655 = A1084660A
? = A1084662A
? = A1084664A
? = A1084666A
KDF-60XS955 = A1084668A
KDF-60XBR950 = A1606041A

Joey Skinner

New member

Username: Jskinner

Post Number: 6
Registered: Jun-07

Posted on Friday, August 17, 2007 - 05:48 pm:

KF42WE610 = A1606006A

Bronze Member

Username: Edenney

Post Number: 28
Registered: Jun-07

Posted on Friday, August 17, 2007 - 05:52 pm:

Steve,

Is the fan included as part of a new Optical Block when it is replaced or is it a completely separate part that merely attaches to the Optical Block or mounts above it? I had speculated previously that any change to correct/improve the blue blob problem (which might be heat related) could possibly be to the fan design, fan power or air flow, but if the fan and the housing for it is a completely separate component which is not included with a new Optical Block, that theory is shot.

I agree that it would useful to 2003 owners to know if the part # of the optical block is the same as some of the 2004 models which are included in the new warranty extension. If they are, that just gives them one more arrow in the quiver to fire at Sony and the ERC. Although I don't think there's any question that the 2003 TVs suffer from the same defect of the same part, I think Sony just isn't extending the warranty on the 2003 owners because their TVs are older than they are financially willing to support.

I personally think that's BS because the average life span of one of these TVs is at least 7 years based on Sony's own method of calculating depreciation, never the less I believe that's why they're deserting the 2003 owners except on a case by case basis. I also think it's BS that my TV which I purchased in mid 2005, is only being supported through the end of 2008 under the warranty extension on the Optical Block. This insinuates that the reasonable life span of this part, which costs so much to replace that if it were a car the insurance adjuster would "total" it, is a mere 3.5 years.

Bronze Member

Username: Slinke

Post Number: 18
Registered: May-07

Posted on Friday, August 17, 2007 - 06:10 pm:

I was working at home the day my optical block was replaced (and it was a very busy day, indeed). So, unfortunately, I did not have time to watch the process and note any differences between the old and new optical blocks. And I don't have the inclination of opening everything back up to look.

If I were to speculate, I would say that based on the way it is screwed on, the fan is an integral part of the optical block. On the other hand, Frank Connors' photos make it appear that his fan was disconnected from the rest of the optical block, which would suggest that it might have been removed for reattachment to the new block (hopefully, after a thorough cleaning). Perhaps the entire part on the left of Frank's photo (the fan and the area that connects to the lamp) gets moved. Frank, can you comment on this?

I have now compiled a complete list of optical block part numbers, and every model has a different number, and I found duplicate numbers for most (the ones in parentheses appear to be replaced by the non-parenthetical ones):

2003 Grand WEGA
KF42WE610 = A1606006A (A1606033A)
KF50WE610 = A1606008A (A1606035A)
KF60WE610 = A1606010A (A1606036A)

2004 Grand WEGA
KDF42WE655 = A1084658A (A1056437A)
KDF50WE655 = A1084660A (A1057972A)
KDF55WF655 = A1084662A (A1060807A)
KDF60WF655 = A1084664A (A1061049A)
KDF55XS955 = A1084666A (A1061489A)
KDF-60XS955 = A1084668A (A1061404A)
KF42WE620 = A1086496A
KF50WE620 = A1086497A

SXRD
KDF60XBR950 = A1606041A (A1606042A)
KDF70XBR950 = A1606039A (A1606040A)

New member

Username: A_gibler

Onawa, IA
USA

Post Number: 1
Registered: Aug-07

Posted on Friday, August 17, 2007 - 10:43 pm:

KDF-E50A10 Manufactured 8/05

Just starting this process today with customer service. Told they had no "alerts" regarding these problems, but we should have a service call performed and gave us a ref#. Called the service center, told they had no knowledge of any problems like this, but they'd be happy to perform a service call for $90.

Our problem started a few months ago with distinct horizontal colored lines when the tv was first turned on, which faded to much lighter or even invisible at times; progressed to include discoloration at bottom of the screen in an almost halo like fashion as it seemed to move up the sides of the screen. At times it seemed to have a faint, almost crackled appearance. It then quite rapidly progressed to what is now a total blue to light blue screen with almost strobe light appearance (or white blob?) depending on the angle from which its viewed. Regardless of changing inputs etc, we don't even see the little message at the upper left of the screen (anyone else experience this?) any longer.

Our plan is to proceed with the service call and get the "diagnosis", send certified letters to Sir Howard Stringer CEO, and the ERC, as well as provide info to customer service with the ref#. Any additional advice would be considered.

Hard to imagine Sony isn't stepping up to acknowledge full responsibility yet. I'm aware they have stepped up in some cases. I fear the battle has just begun for us, but as with other cases described here, we'll work to get Sony to do the right thing. I have always thought of Sony products as being of highest quality, so let's hope they don't disappoint us in how they choose to handle these problems! Good luck to everyone!

Bronze Member

Username: Edenney

Post Number: 29
Registered: Jun-07

Posted on Friday, August 17, 2007 - 11:24 pm:

Allison:

Your explanation of the problems you've experienced with your TV seem rather unusual and make me wonder if you haven't experienced some concurrent/consecutive combination of problems. If so, at least one of them sounds like it's a variation of the "blob" problem.

Please post a couple pictures of what your picture currently looks like, even though it may have looked different at one point in time. Also, if you haven't already, scan through the pictures that are attached to previous messages posted in this thread over the last 6 months or so and see which ones, if any, seem to match what you've experienced with your TV.

If the problem with your TV is more visible against certain backgrounds, try to take find a way to take the picture against a similar color. The "blue blob" problem is most visible against a white or light colored backround for example. If your TV has a media stick input the easiest way is to create an image of the desired color and display it on the TV. Alternatively you may have a device hooked up to your TV that generates a solid color when it's in screen saver mode etc.. Time Warner has a diagnostic channel (199 in my area) that has a gray background that also works well for showing off the blue blob problem.

You'll still need a formal disgnosis from a tech, but we might be able to provide some additional guidance on this forum once we see what the problem is.

New member

Username: A_gibler

Onawa, IA
USA

Post Number: 2
Registered: Aug-07

Posted on Saturday, August 18, 2007 - 12:48 am:

Eric,
Our screen looks alot like that posted above by Navarro, except it has an approx dime sized white/light mark in the center with an upward directed beacon or strobe - kind of like a giant V. It doesn't matter whether there is or is not a device etc - same appearance - we can't change it from the solid screen appearance regardless of what we do (other than turn it off).

When we first turn it on, there are very distinct thin, horizontal multiple colored lines across the screen that fade within a minute or two and the screen starts off darker blue at the bottom then lightens a bit all over and forms the beacon type appearance in the center after another minute or so. Nothing we do changes this appearance at all.

Bronze Member

Username: Edenney

Post Number: 30
Registered: Jun-07

Posted on Saturday, August 18, 2007 - 02:11 am:

Allison:

It definitely sounds like you have a variant of the "blob" problem, with the source being the Optical Block. If it's at all possible for you to post some pictures that would be great, but you're definitely going to need to get it examined by a Sony authorized tech. before anything else can happen.

Yours is the first KDF-E50A10 that I've seen mentioned in this forum that potentionally has the blob type of problem, so that's another reason I find it unusual. It may also be the first reported mid-2005 or newer rear projection Sony which potentially has the problem (at least that I've seen). There have been a few other owners of that model that have reported other misc. unrelated issues, but none with the blob defect.

I mention these things because it's going to be important for owners to know whether the same defect exists in the 2005 models, not just the 2004 and 2003 models. Since the Optical block usually takes about 2 years to fail with an average amount of usage, this is right about the time we'd start to see the failures if the 2005 models are defective as well.

New member

Username: A_gibler

Onawa, IA
USA

Post Number: 3
Registered: Aug-07

Posted on Saturday, August 18, 2007 - 08:35 am:

I'll try to get some pictures and post them to this site. I noticed there are some prior posts from someone with a 42" version of our set in the archives through the end of July, but I don't remember exactly what the issue was - just that Sony offered to give credit towards another TV.

Frank Connors

Bronze Member

Username: Farmerpig

Post Number: 11
Registered: Jul-07

Posted on Saturday, August 18, 2007 - 11:33 am:

Eric D & Steve, Yes in fact the fan was replaced..It is part of the entire Optical Block that was replaced...A small electronic board attached outside of the optical block was also replaced...There was no dust on my LCD's (that I could see) it was burned and cracked due to the large amount of heat build up caused by dust in the fan..proper air movement was decreased due to the dust and no way to properly cool the heat from the lamp..
I hope this makes sense....This is my take anyway and what the tech found....I would have to say a better cooling system design & dust filter would be a way to solve this....I think........Also there is just no way of cleaning this...My tech said only replacement of the optical block is the cure....Like I said before, I am now repaired...The picture is Great, Just like new...But my warranty is only 30 days labor & 90 days Parts...Almost as much time as it took me to get it fixed....Sony really needs to work on that 7 year thing.......

Bronze Member

Username: Edenney

Post Number: 31
Registered: Jun-07

Posted on Saturday, August 18, 2007 - 11:35 am:

I went through the last several months of archives prior to posting that message last night, the few owners of your same model each had an unrelated, unique problem.

Bronze Member

Username: Edenney

Post Number: 32
Registered: Jun-07

Posted on Saturday, August 18, 2007 - 11:39 am:

That's helpful information, thanks Frank. My theory that they likely modified the fan or some aspect of the cooling in the new Optical Blocks to address the blob problem is still plausible then. Although it's still just an educated guess.

New member

Username: A_gibler

Onawa, IA
USA

Post Number: 4
Registered: Aug-07

Posted on Saturday, August 18, 2007 - 01:27 pm:

Some progress made with the store where we purchased our KDF-e50a10 in 10/05. Our optical block is still under warranty (2 yrs?) it appears. They'll give us $1500 credit towards purchase of another set essentially. So if we don't feel inclined to have the latest, greatest set, the Sony KDS-55A20L1 can be purchased for about $160 more plus tax (with credit card to double the warranty). Trying to decide whether to pursue with Sony or make the switch and be done with it. Any others made similar decision?

New member

Username: A_gibler

Onawa, IA
USA

Post Number: 5
Registered: Aug-07

Posted on Saturday, August 18, 2007 - 01:28 pm:

Correction to last post - it's a KDS-55A20L1. Sorry.

Bronze Member

Username: Edenney

Post Number: 33
Registered: Jun-07

Posted on Saturday, August 18, 2007 - 02:29 pm:

Yes, the warranty card on rear projection TVs manufactured in the last couple years does specify a 2 year warranty on the Optical Block. The warranty cards on the 2004 and maybe 2003 rear projection TVs is virtually identical but it specifies 2 years on the "Color Picture Tube" which rear projection TVs don't have. There is some disagreement about what that means, it is my belief that it was essentially a typo since at that time this was new technology and they don't usually use highly technical terms like "optical block" to reference the major component that is responsible for producing the picture. I believe that they were definitely referring to the Optical Block in the 2003 and 2004 warranties but that they were just using layman's terms, and that they corrected the terminology in the 2005 and later warranty cards, at least on most of the models.

In any event, I didn't even realize when you posted that it was still August and that you might well still be within your 2 year period on your Optical Block. That's great and saves you some unnecessary trouble. I looked at the specs on the TV you can upgrade to and I think that's definitely what I would do if I were you, assuming you don't have any other upgrade options such as to an LCD.

One of the biggest reasons I would upgrade for such a nominal amount of money, even if the TVs were identical, is because it gets you into a brand new TV and a new warranty, and gives you the valuable opportunity to purchase a lengthy extended warranty which I very highly recommend with HD TVs. Not only will you not have to worry about the Optical Block or anything else for the next several years, but you won't have to pay for new lamps which run you about $200-$250 if you install it yourself, and have to be replaced every 1-2 years depending on usage. That alone makes an extended warranty worthwhile.

Aside from the fact that you're getting a new TV with a new warranty, the model you listed has several advantages of your existing TV. The new TV is 5 inches larger and it's a full 1080P, as opposed to your current TV which is only 1080i. It also has a higher native resolution of 1920x1080 vs your current 1280x720. It has 2 HDMI inputs vs. your 1, which is important as more and more devices incoroporate HDMI, the new industry standard. There arew other differences but those are the most important specs that differentiate the two in my opinion.

If you do upgrade to the new rear projection TV, I can't stress enough the importance of getting a lengthy extended warranty. If you don't have the money right now, you can wait until you're nearing the end of the 1 year manufacturer's warranty and purchase it from Sony then. You just have to purchase it while your current warranty is still in effect.

It's a no brainer for me, but let us know what you decide to do...

Joey Skinner

New member

Username: Jskinner

Post Number: 7
Registered: Jun-07

Posted on Saturday, August 18, 2007 - 06:21 pm:

An uninterruptible power supply (UPS) would be a wise addition for any TV with a lamp especially if you have frequent power outages. With no power to run the fan, the heat build up will damage the LCDs. I've read that the blue LCD on Sonys is the closest to the lamp and that is why you usually get the blue blob. Power outages and dust on the fan causes heat that damages the LCD. You may wonder why they don't have a user servicable filter and a bigger cfm fan. Fan noise would be objectionable and people would complain. A filter would be ignored by most people and when clogged would cause the heat problem to appear quicker. My solution to all this was to get a plasma TV. Plasmas have their own problems but at least I'll never have to replace a lamp

Frank Connors

Bronze Member

Username: Farmerpig

Post Number: 12
Registered: Jul-07

Posted on Saturday, August 18, 2007 - 07:12 pm:

UPS very good idea...I can't afford a 70" Plasma...