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Thread: Lies your audiophilic mother may have you told. |
    
Bronze Member Username: I_am_kirk
Post Number: 87
Registered: May-08
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| Posted on Friday, March 20, 2009 - 12:32 am: |
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http://www.theaudiocritic.com/downloads/article_1.pdf
Interesting read. Likely has been posted here but I can not find it. Fire away lol. |
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Silver Member Username: Smwick
B.C
Canada
Post Number: 222
Registered: Dec-07
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| Posted on Friday, March 20, 2009 - 12:44 am: |
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Some truth in there, but a lot of BS as well. This has been posted many times here. |
Bronze Member Username: I_am_kirk
Post Number: 88
Registered: May-08
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| Posted on Friday, March 20, 2009 - 09:46 am: |
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Which parts do you think are BS? |
Gold Member Username: Dmitchell
Ottawa,
Ontario
Canada
Post Number: 2313
Registered: Feb-07
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| Posted on Friday, March 20, 2009 - 10:05 am: |
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Some true, some maybe not so true.
I agree with the power conditioner point. A power conditioner has no place in an audio system. HT maybe, but I'd never plug my amps into my power conditioner - I use it for my Plasma TV.
I think a lot of people on here would disagree with the analogue vs. digital point. There's quite a few guys on here that swear by their vinyl rigs, and there's convincing evidence to confirm that vinyl may actually sound better.
Same goes for tubes.
I also disagree with the cable point. I've actually heard differences in cables. Case in point - I had a pair of Audioquest cables that were by far the worst sounding cables I have ever heard. I gave them to George! |
Platinum Member Username: Jan_b_vigne
Dallas,
TX
Post Number: 13414
Registered: May-04
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| Posted on Friday, March 20, 2009 - 10:07 am: |
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"Which parts do you think are BS?"
The idea that anyone would believe those ten items are lies is BS. If you care to be a cynic, that's your business. No one who feels cables, CD treatments or system set up matters is interested in you blinding following their lead. Stores offer auditions which are aimed at you making your own decisions. Audio reviewers suggest you audition any product - hopefully in your own system - before you take their word for anything.
On the other hand, the naysayers are always the ones who insist you do as they tell you and do not think for yourself. They are the first to start insulting others with claims of "snake oil" and "charlatan" and then get progressively strident from there.
Reading what the cynics and conspiracy proponents write is one thing, you should expose yourself to numerous opinions while recognizing they are only opinions. If you want to call dozens of respected audio journalists and multitudes of educated and experienced listeners fools, that's quite another thing and it says more about you than it does those people this article attacks.
And, yes, this has been discussed numerous times on this and any other audio forum you click into. The die-hards who have never tried a specific treatment - they won't try cables because they already know cables don't matter, they won't try CD treatments because bits are bits - are the ones who keep the threads going long after everything has been said. If you want to be of the opinion that only things that can be measured can be heard, then you'll find a home where that article was printed. If you want to believe your ears, you'll find most if not all of those items in that article are BS.
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Gold Member Username: Artk
Albany,
Oregon
USA
Post Number: 9200
Registered: Feb-05
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| Posted on Friday, March 20, 2009 - 11:12 am: |
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Jan and I don't agree on much but we are in total agreement here. |
Platinum Member Username: Nuck
Post Number: 11850
Registered: Dec-04
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| Posted on Friday, March 20, 2009 - 12:48 pm: |
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Have a name and get published, even tripe. |
Gold Member Username: Frank_abela
Berkshire
UK
Post Number: 3598
Registered: Sep-04
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| Posted on Friday, March 20, 2009 - 01:03 pm: |
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It's depressing how often I see the likes of this or that other twit who tests speaker cable with cheap nasty screw twist connections. the thing is their arguments seem so sensible. "It's obvious that a wire is a wire and can't possibly make a difference!" or "Just think of the miles of cable coiled up in your transformer - why should a couple of metres of speaker cable make any difference?" or...it goes on. What claptrap.
You know, once upon a time everyone knew that the earth was flat... |
Gold Member Username: Artk
Albany,
Oregon
USA
Post Number: 9201
Registered: Feb-05
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| Posted on Friday, March 20, 2009 - 01:46 pm: |
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Exactly Frank...if we presently know everything what need is there for science. More questions unanswered than answered. |
Silver Member Username: Smwick
B.C
Canada
Post Number: 224
Registered: Dec-07
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| Posted on Friday, March 20, 2009 - 01:47 pm: |
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The only parts of that garbage I have found truth in, relates to power conditioners being of no value and people claiming to have a golden ear. Now with in the power conditioner lie he talks about power cords all being the same. That part I don't agree with, as I have found there are differences. |
Bronze Member Username: Chrisgwd
California
Post Number: 38
Registered: Aug-06
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| Posted on Friday, March 20, 2009 - 06:25 pm: |
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I guess I have two cents like everyone else...
I tend to think that many of these tweaks may make a system sound a little different. Maybe some color the sound in a way that is pleasing to your ears. Maybe they compensate for deficiencies in your equipment.
A power conditioner may make a huge difference in a system where wall power is very noisy and the amp in your system has a weak power conditioning section.
As for being cost effective in putting together a system, my thinking is that the most direct factors in good sound are the recording, the speakers, and the room. Drive them with good clean power. Other things are secondary.
If you have bundles of money and the most direct factors in your system are 100% there, maybe you can squeak a little more spending big dollars on tweaks.
And of course, the bottom line is to listen to what your own ears tell you. No one else listens to your system in your room with your ears. |
Bronze Member Username: Chrisgwd
California
Post Number: 39
Registered: Aug-06
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| Posted on Friday, March 20, 2009 - 06:30 pm: |
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PS - by the way, the integral of e^x is e^x + c |
Gold Member Username: Petergalbraith
Canada
Post Number: 2216
Registered: Feb-04
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| Posted on Saturday, March 21, 2009 - 03:56 pm: |
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The answer depends on the forum you frequent. :-) |
Platinum Member Username: Nuck
Post Number: 11867
Registered: Dec-04
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| Posted on Saturday, March 21, 2009 - 04:02 pm: |
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I have an XTC album. |
Gold Member Username: Dmitchell
Ottawa,
Ontario
Canada
Post Number: 2324
Registered: Feb-07
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| Posted on Saturday, March 21, 2009 - 04:06 pm: |
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"The answer depends on the forum you frequent. :-)"
So true. Try starting a cables thread on CAM... |
New member Username: Ninefoothoagies
Post Number: 9
Registered: Mar-09
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| Posted on Friday, March 27, 2009 - 06:58 pm: |
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I was part of a test session conducted by some students at Stevens Tech in Hoboken-- different brands of premium cable against one another, as well as against stout (12 ga) utility wire. I couldn't notice any differences among them. But that's me. Others claimed they could hear differences. But in many instances, they just flat out got the answers wrong when asked to identify a particular cable on second and third listenings. I gladly concede that there could be many reasons for this.
I'll take my chances with reasonably stout speaker wires and decent connectors, and pour any money I might spend on audiophile cables into (in order of preference) better speakers, sources, and amplification/control.
Then again, there's a limit to what I'll spend--I'm ever mindful of the law of diminishing returns. But I can understand how the pursuit of those "diminishing returns" is precisely what motivates true purists. And that pursuit is what drives innovation.
For those who have no limits, it's your money; more power to you. I'd be presumptuous to brand as "lies" something I've only dabbled in. I'll trust the experts, but believe my own ears as well. |
Gold Member Username: Artk
Albany,
Oregon
USA
Post Number: 9264
Registered: Feb-05
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| Posted on Friday, March 27, 2009 - 07:12 pm: |
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Even though I'm not rich, I do buy cables that I enjoy based on the fact that I hear the differences but respect those who don't as well.
Your post was well stated Jimbob. |
Bronze Member Username: Ninefoothoagies
Post Number: 12
Registered: Mar-09
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| Posted on Friday, March 27, 2009 - 07:23 pm: |
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Thanks, Art. My feelings on paying beaucoup for accessories mirror those I have about the benefits of Velcro and Tang vis-a-vis the cost of America's space program.
But as the parent of wee ones who can't tie their shoes yet, Velcro is a godsend, irrespective of what it cost to develop...
So, yes, I applaud those who keep moving the high-end higher, mostly because it serves to elevate all levels sooner or later. I just haven't answered the calling... |
Platinum Member Username: Nuck
Post Number: 11940
Registered: Dec-04
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| Posted on Friday, March 27, 2009 - 07:45 pm: |
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Agreed |
Bronze Member Username: Db_audiofile
La habra,
Ca
Usa
Post Number: 86
Registered: Aug-07
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| Posted on Friday, March 27, 2009 - 08:41 pm: |
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Gents,
There is an old addage in Hi-fi, (yes I go back that far) if you can't here a diference there isnt one. IF YOU CAN'T DON'T SPEND THE MONEY!!!
As far as Identifing difference in cables that is easy. Once you know what to listen for. I have better than average cables and there is a diference. To spend 500$ plus is insane. Like all things, Do like the sound?
That is always your best Judgement.
Db |
Gold Member Username: Gavdawg
Albany,
New York
Post Number: 1261
Registered: Nov-06
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| Posted on Sunday, April 05, 2009 - 09:39 am: |
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I have also switched out my cables recently, and have monster (I know...I know...what I started with), canare, anticables, and now audioquest. I can hear a difference in all of them.
The nod is going to my audioquest for being the most open.
I always felt like the monster cables were veiling, same as (but to a greater degree than) the canare. |
Gold Member Username: Dmitchell
Ottawa,
Ontario
Canada
Post Number: 2393
Registered: Feb-07
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| Posted on Sunday, April 05, 2009 - 09:10 pm: |
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Hey Gavin, I've been curious about anti-cables for awhile. Tell me more about your thoughts on them. |
Gold Member Username: Gavdawg
Albany,
New York
Post Number: 1266
Registered: Nov-06
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| Posted on Wednesday, April 08, 2009 - 11:54 am: |
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the anti cable is a good performer with very good image and detail retrieval, but is a pain in the ar$e to work with...very stiff.
I just prefer the audioquest as it seems to work better with my system. The soundstage has enlarged compared to what it was through the anticables (not that I thought it to be small) and fine detail retrieval sounds less in your face.
They are good cables... the main drawback I can think of is that they are really stiff.
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Gold Member Username: Dmitchell
Ottawa,
Ontario
Canada
Post Number: 2415
Registered: Feb-07
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| Posted on Wednesday, April 08, 2009 - 11:58 am: |
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Interesting. Thanks Gavin. |
Gold Member Username: Gavdawg
Albany,
New York
Post Number: 1267
Registered: Nov-06
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| Posted on Wednesday, April 08, 2009 - 12:19 pm: |
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I revised that to make it sound less like I hate them  I don't... I think they are good cables but likely overhyped much like almost everything. |
