Archive through April 25, 2008

Gold Member

Username: Mike3

Wylie, Tx
USA

Post Number: 1068
Registered: May-06

Posted on Tuesday, January 29, 2008 - 12:08 am:

This is a thread for “newbies”, however anybody can gain something from it provided that the old dawgs as well as the usual suspects are willing to share.

What I am hoping is that everyone will share and contribute. Think of this as akin to brainstorming where no input is up for criticisms.

Jan got me thinking about this with her challenge to us as to “Why source first?”. Why, because we speak from experience for the most part. Who better to regal in all our glory, set-backs, triumphs, embarrassments, enjoyments, and frustrations in our audiophile journeys? Everyone who reads this has done something to enable themselves to enjoy the sound they listen to and being here implies that one worked at it to some degree at least.

“worked at it to some degree at least” is what I think we can contribute to newbies. No I am not saying we should put together an encyclopedia of what is right and wrong because what is right for me might be wrong for you. Yet if we both post our opposite efforts a reasoned reader may try both and find one to their liking.

Allow me a minor digression please. Another thing that got me thinking about this is that I leant a good friend of mine, Jim, my Sennheisers with the Cardas cables and I told him he should hear an improvement over his Bose noise canceling cans. He did not. I believe him. You and I would have heard it to be sure. The reason Jim thought he did not hear a difference was not because he did not think his were better than mine. He said he is not an experienced listener so to him the subtleties and nuances were not to be found. That sort of stuck with me.

We often offer our opinions to newbies and each other about what certain gear should sound like, what they should consider purchasing, how it works for us or how we heard it. What if they are like Jim and cannot hear what we hear when we suggest something to them? Why not tell them how it is we got to where we could offer that opinion? That way it may be reasonable for them to contemplate even if they have not gotten to the level we are in what we hear. In no way am I suggesting anything more than I used to have to A/B, A/B, A/B, A/B for several minutes on some changes or tweaks I would make. Now I can pretty much pick up that subtleties in seconds with a single A/B. Another example is Nuck can hear the intricacies of a drummers timing and beat at a level foreign to me. Jan can capture the cohesiveness of a presentation and its overall musicality better than anyone I ever met. Newbies for the most part probably cannot do these things like we can.

I pretty much have an idea of where Jan’s opinions come from, as well as Nuck’s, and I can make an educated guess as to where Frank’s offerings come from, but I cannot say that for more than maybe one or two more of us.

Again, this is just why do you have the kit / system you have now, how did you get there, what did you do to tweak it. I certainly do not expect anyone to relate this all in one post of course. Perhaps I will post something about how I treated my room and that might generate a few additional offerings. Someone may discuss their tribulations with cartridges which may be unique and not gain any other follow ups. There is no expectations or requirements.

If newbies knew why we moved to separates or thought power conditioners were needed it would be beneficial to their making a reasoned decision and easier for them to move forward to whatever we post that strikes them as most relative. I for one have no idea what someone may find relative or not, but I am willing to put it out there for consideration.

That’s about as simple as I could make it.

If I am covering old ground just let me know where we have this already, other than spread out over the entire forum.

A forum member, Thorsten, asked about good music recently and someone sent him a link to “Your reference library”. Bingo. That is what I envision this to be for newbies wading into the audiophile waters.

Relevant Product Info

Gold Member

Username: Gavdawg

Upstate, New York

Post Number: 1060
Registered: Nov-06

Posted on Tuesday, January 29, 2008 - 12:49 am:

I learned from all the mistakes I have made in equipment matching (ex: trying to mate klipsch speakers to an onkyo receiver).

I also have friends and relations that still play instruments (sax and guitar, my two main vices, I know how they sound unamped and hear them frequently)

my fiancee is also a sax player, but has not picked hers up in some time.

It is all a learning experience. For me, the start of it all was finding out what NOT to do, because I already did it and couldn't figure out why the sound was bad.

Thanks to you all here, I have learned that equipment synergy is only part of the equation, and have discovered a hobby that I never may have found a passion for :-P

I made the move to separates because of the improvement in sound quality when doing a cost benefit analysis. The integrated amp currently in my system simply sounds better than a similarly priced receiver. I do have a Cambridge Soundworks 730 when I want to listen to the radio nearby.

Gold Member

Username: Gavdawg

Upstate, New York

Post Number: 1061
Registered: Nov-06

Posted on Tuesday, January 29, 2008 - 12:52 am:

wow... I am dead to the world...

I will return to this when I am more awake and read the original post more coherently.

Andre Money (---None of it?)

Gold Member

Username: Mike3

Wylie, Tx
USA

Post Number: 1071
Registered: May-06

Posted on Tuesday, January 29, 2008 - 01:04 am:

Gavin,

inre your 2nd post: "Think of this as akin to brainstorming where no input is up for criticisms."

Nice start with your first post!

I too am where you are at and will offer up a contribution another day.

david pannell

Silver Member

Username: Davidpa

Portland, Oregon
US

Post Number: 523
Registered: Nov-05

Posted on Tuesday, January 29, 2008 - 01:39 am:

My honest opinion on this is simple.

If you dont attend live concerts or shows, or, are not a musician personally, the nuances really dont matter as much as those that frequent live events, or play an instrument. Most people, including many of my friends, see, and hear what my system does, but dont understand WHY it sounds so good, or why I went through the trouble to put it together the way I did. And, although it impresses them, they have no desire, or passion to do the same. Most people want "the best in this price range", which means so many different things, but to the average Joe, it means how loud does it go? Some, like Andre (no offense meant here) just want alot of bass, others want to hear the guitar solo, and how well that particular instrument is presented. Is it wrong? Nope, just a preference. But, when a system is truly symetrical, and balanced, even if a guy loves it, and would love to have it, does not mean that he will go out to pursue it.

Gold Member

Username: Arande2

Rattle your ...
Missouri

Post Number: 2807
Registered: Dec-06

Posted on Tuesday, January 29, 2008 - 04:05 am:

I'd like to ask that you not make assumptions, although it's pretty easy to assume from my former words that I like a lot of bass.

You would have to meet me in person to know for sure.

Thanks.

Gold Member

Username: Mike3

Wylie, Tx
USA

Post Number: 1072
Registered: May-06

Posted on Tuesday, January 29, 2008 - 08:47 am:

So Andre, what would your contribution be, albeit not making assumptions about anything is a good start?

Gold Member

Username: Mike3

Wylie, Tx
USA

Post Number: 1073
Registered: May-06

Posted on Tuesday, January 29, 2008 - 08:52 am:

david, I have had similar reactions from friends who have heard my system, except if they happen to be musicians. They get it! Others will come up to listen to it whenever they come over (maybe because I make them LOL) and ask for their favorite artist ect. Heck, Marsh does not get it but she will listen remotely in the house. The fact that someone comes to us to me means they might want a little bit more than how loud does it go, but if that is what they want we should be able to help them with that too.

Thanks for your input!

Gold Member

Username: Gavdawg

Upstate, New York

Post Number: 1062
Registered: Nov-06

Posted on Tuesday, January 29, 2008 - 09:38 am:

a clean, cohesive midrange is most appealing to me now. When I first started, I was drawn to the speakers that had the "boom and sizzle" curve built in. As my ear changed, I learned that wasn't what I was looking for.

I agree with Mike and Dave on the reaction. My mother loves my Paradigm Atoms because of the warm, smooth sound. They simply sound more like real music to her. When my cuz was playing her sax during our Christmas get-together, she told me that the recording sounded almost as good as the real thing.

I really believe having relatives that play musical instruments, and hearing them often has played a key part in what I am looking for in midrange reproduction.

Of course, the treble can't be brittle and the bass can't be flabby or loose.

David Mitchell

Silver Member

Username: Dmitchell

Ottawa, Ontario
Canada

Post Number: 600
Registered: Feb-07

Posted on Tuesday, January 29, 2008 - 09:49 am:

I have to agree with Gavin - a good midrange is most important to me now that I have developed a better ear to what sounds good (to me).

I discovered this when I recently purchased my Monitor Audio speakers to replace my Paradigms.

When I first bought the Paradigms a couple of years ago I thought they were the cats meow, but after living with them over time the sound of them changed to me and I did not enjoy them anymore.

That brings me to another point. It seems to me, the longer you are in this hobby, the more critical and picky one becomes. The reasoning here is that when you first start out (unless you are a musician in the first place, with a well developed sense of what sounds "right") you have no idea what sounds good. When I first started out in this hobby (I am still a relative newcomer) I thought my old Kenwood receiver and Yamaha speakers sounded fantastic. If I went back and listened to that now I'd probably think "holy crap, that sounds like sh!t".

Gold Member

Username: Gavdawg

Upstate, New York

Post Number: 1063
Registered: Nov-06

Posted on Tuesday, January 29, 2008 - 11:04 am:

David, I also have switched speakers...

The first to go were Bose.

Although, I don't really mind the '01 series. Good sounding among the KLH and Sony stuff they are sold next to... However sound like crap next to kef, klipsch, and athena (kef is now sold at CC...found out after I bought mine)

The first pair of "decent" speakers I heard were Bose 301's. First pair I owned were 201's.

Gold Member

Username: Gavdawg

Upstate, New York

Post Number: 1064
Registered: Nov-06

Posted on Tuesday, January 29, 2008 - 11:30 am:

now I own kef, after switching out my maggies due to room integration issues. My maggies are boxed up at my mothers house in central NY, in a closet in my old bedroom. I won't part with them right now.

.

http://forum.ecoustics.com/bbs/messages/1/441498.html

http://forum.ecoustics.com/bbs/messages/1/431447.html

Platinum Member

Username: Jan_b_vigne

Dallas, TX

Post Number: 12188
Registered: May-04

Posted on Tuesday, January 29, 2008 - 11:58 am:

Platinum Member

Username: Jan_b_vigne

Dallas, TX

Post Number: 12189
Registered: May-04

Posted on Tuesday, January 29, 2008 - 11:59 am:

.

Might as well;

http://forum.ecoustics.com/bbs/messages/1/435932.html

Gold Member

Username: Mike3

Wylie, Tx
USA

Post Number: 1074
Registered: May-06

Posted on Tuesday, January 29, 2008 - 01:27 pm:

Ideal links Jan. Anybody who is serious about wanting a system that works should be more than willing to take the time to read through them. Heck I just took the time to read through them and I had already read them each once before.

Plus posting the links beats the pants off of having to type all that out again here.

Platinum Member

Username: Jan_b_vigne

Dallas, TX

Post Number: 12200
Registered: May-04

Posted on Wednesday, January 30, 2008 - 08:07 pm:

.

http://forum.ecoustics.com/bbs/messages/1/438742.html

Platinum Member

Username: Jan_b_vigne

Dallas, TX

Post Number: 12266
Registered: May-04

Posted on Wednesday, February 13, 2008 - 12:51 pm:

.

http://forum.ecoustics.com/bbs/messages/1/447247.html

Nick K

Gold Member

Username: Nickelbut10

Post Number: 1183
Registered: Jun-07

Posted on Wednesday, February 13, 2008 - 02:44 pm:

"Jan got me thinking about this with her challenge to us as to “Why source first?”"

Ok...ok...hold up...Jan, are you a guy or girl? lol sorry I have always called u a guy, and Mike just said you were a girl. I am confused.

Gold Member

Username: Nuck

Post Number: 9785
Registered: Dec-04

Posted on Wednesday, February 13, 2008 - 02:59 pm:

I think the term is 'experienced audio specialist'.

Platinum Member

Username: Jan_b_vigne

Dallas, TX

Post Number: 12268
Registered: May-04

Posted on Wednesday, February 13, 2008 - 03:02 pm:

.

I've never listed the contents of any of my audio systems in my forum profile since I don't believe the equipment I possess should be of any consequence to an on line discussion. You can judge what I say on the basis of what I say not what components I use. I will tell you I have stood side by side with a salesman who was bright enough to think speakers completely stopped working when they were connected out of phase. After I explained how a component worked, the customer turned to Bubba and asked if my explanation was correct.

.

Gold Member

Username: Nuck

Post Number: 9786
Registered: Dec-04

Posted on Wednesday, February 13, 2008 - 03:08 pm:

Bubba...hehehe...

Nick K

Gold Member

Username: Nickelbut10

Post Number: 1184
Registered: Jun-07

Posted on Wednesday, February 13, 2008 - 03:11 pm:

Damn right Jan is an expert, it totally doesn't matter if your female or male, I was just curious for own sake because Ive been calling you a dude this whole time. My bad.

stryvn

Silver Member

Username: Stryvn

Wisconsin

Post Number: 677
Registered: Dec-06

Posted on Wednesday, February 13, 2008 - 03:13 pm:

ummm, we have already established, through another thread, that Jan is really a rebadged Bob Smith.

Now can we please move on before we wreck another decent thread?

Gold Member

Username: Nuck

Post Number: 9787
Registered: Dec-04

Posted on Wednesday, February 13, 2008 - 03:23 pm:

Just lighter.

Nick K

Gold Member

Username: Nickelbut10

Post Number: 1185
Registered: Jun-07

Posted on Wednesday, February 13, 2008 - 03:25 pm:

My bad Stryvn....

Platinum Member

Username: Jan_b_vigne

Dallas, TX

Post Number: 12269
Registered: May-04

Posted on Wednesday, February 13, 2008 - 03:28 pm:

.

My inputs and outputs are in a different location than BS's. Therefore ...

Gold Member

Username: Nuck

Post Number: 9788
Registered: Dec-04

Posted on Wednesday, February 13, 2008 - 03:34 pm:

That brings me to another point. It seems to me, the longer you are in this hobby, the more critical and picky one becomes. The reasoning here is that when you first start out (unless you are a musician in the first place, with a well developed sense of what sounds "right") you have no idea what sounds good. When I first started out in this hobby (I am still a relative newcomer) I thought my old Kenwood receiver and Yamaha speakers sounded fantastic. If I went back and listened to that now I'd probably think "holy crap, that sounds like sh!t".

Yep. Exposure to live music and reading too much about stereo's does that to a person.

Gold Member

Username: Nuck

Post Number: 9789
Registered: Dec-04

Posted on Wednesday, February 13, 2008 - 03:35 pm:

I tried to explain the hobby to a few people.
Looked at me like I had 10 heads.

M.R.

Gold Member

Username: My_rantz

Australia

Post Number: 1835
Registered: Nov-05

Posted on Tuesday, February 19, 2008 - 07:02 pm:

When my brother visited last year, I had both the Apollo and the Naim CD51 in our system. I played one track on the Apollo then again on the Naim. It took him 30 secs to comment that the Naim was the more engaging of the two. I had thought the same, but it took quite a bit more than 30 secs for me. While I had realised that I did prefer the Naim, it really took me about two weeks to make the committment to sell the Apollo. Both made very good music for sure, but in the end I found that with the Naim I was really enjoying some cd's that beforehand I could take or leave.

Upgrading from the NAD C162/C272 to the Musical Fidelity A5 was a slightly different experience in that the music became alive. I guess it was like I'd been listening with wax in my ears, like a dullness had disappeared. That's probably a slight exaggeration, but it's about the best way to describe the experience. The A5 is just a great piece of gear in my books, it delivers the slam when it's needed and has a clarity and richness without being forward. I took a bit of a risk getting it from a Singapore merchant on Ebay but it turned out for the best.

I feel the same way about the Quads compared to the B&W's (602S3) I had previously - again it was like a dullness had been lifted. These things really sing once the right placement has been found (even when you think you have found it, keep experimenting because you may not have quite had it right after all).

I still enjoy hi-res surround music, but admittedly play it less now because of (a) lack of new material and (b) the two channel gear is so satisfying anyway. My Marantz reciever has been delivering the goods for almost five years now without a hitch. It started life driving all speakers but now it only has center and surround duties. I use the NAD for 2 channel SACD/DVD-A, and for std def DVD movies. The Panasonic BD player is for HD movies and surround DVD-A, it doesn't upconvert std DVD as good as the M55 does so the NAD is staying with us. Having listened to Chris Botti's Blu-ray concert in 5.1 PCM I look forward to many more music titles.

As far cables and interconnects go there hasn't been much around my area from which to compare. I had Radioshack type I/C's, to Monster to the Merlins I have now which are good enough to stop any thoughts of upgraditis in this area and speaker cables have been electrical wire to Monster 10g, to Kimber (2nd lowest one) to Kordz 14g Bi-wire to the Vanden Huls I have now which I find also very satisfying.

The turntable is a different beast for me to explain (due to limited experience) and I find it appealing or I can take or leave it - I guess it depends on the disc quality. It's something I'm still fiddling with, but in all honesty, with late cd's or well remastered ones, I must say I find the Naim the more engaging when it comes to music.

Source first? I think so - unless they are really crap, speakers in general should reveal the difference between a good source or a poor one. How much of a difference will depend on the quality of the speaker and the amplification and what the signals pass through. In what order - though I haven't had experince with a lot of gear, excluding room acoustics, I'd say source, speakers, amplification then cables.

I guess if I'm honest when something new is introduced into the system I listen for differences such as smooth mids, clean, crisp highs, punchy controlled bass, good focussing and a spacious soundstage where I can imagine where the instruments and voclalists are placed, but in the end it's the music that decides. Right now it has that magical appeal of everything sounding like how it should sound so that I'm completely taken in.

I feel there's not much point in trying to describe the differences in cables/I/C's or components because someone else could probably hear other things, I guess mine has been a journey of reading what some have written here on this forum, of reading reviews and listening to the bits and pieces that have caught my interest. Sometimes I have taken a chance (Ebay) where I could resell something if I didn't find it fitting in and playing well. It has cost some dough - unfortunately some real dough - but I don't regret it. Music has always been an important part of my life (both of our lives really) whether for social ambience or for complete relaxation, I have always loved it and I feel very blessed to be at a point where I feel I have things so right I'll be able to go on for many years with things just the way they are.

But, I promise nothing.

.

Gold Member

Username: Mike3

Wylie, Tx
USA

Post Number: 1121
Registered: May-06

Posted on Tuesday, February 19, 2008 - 10:41 pm:

Nice post M.R. I have something similar I want to post, except I am always to tired or too busy to put it together. It's coming sooner or later.

Neil Waterman

Bronze Member

Username: Jazzman71

Phoenix, AZ
USA

Post Number: 94
Registered: Dec-07

Posted on Sunday, March 16, 2008 - 01:02 am:

Nice idea for a thread.

I may be way off base, but I also have a challenge to those posting. Try and convey this with only generic reference to brand and model names. I believe the process of how various systems were conceived and have evolved is more important than the who replaced who. Some basic reference to cost is probably useful, though, because it gives a rough idea of how much was expended to achieve the upgrade.

Many refer to specific mfrs and models when posting as though any idiot knows what they sound like. Most don't. Describe it without naming it, how you went from Point A to Point B, what the approximate or relative expenditure was, significant differences in the gear, and what difference it made in the system and to your ears. It's not easy, but I think it may be the essence of what this thread is really driving at.

Hold brand/model name references for discussions of system synergy, where that king of thing matters. I have seen numerous threads with valuable discussions of what works with what, what doesn't, etc. There, the additional specifics of mfr/model may be useful, but not in the broader sense.

Most newbies always jump to brand/model, usually without considering what they really want to hear, system synergy, how the system might logically evolve without having to replace everything, what to do first, what impacts the room has, etc. We see all the time those OP's that propose buying $4000 speakers and using a $50 DVD player and a $200 HT amp to run music through them.

This is where links to relevant threads such as Jan has provided are worthwhile. It is frustrating for them because they are ready to buy, but they don't know what to buy or even how to determine what to buy. Worse, they often are not ready or receptive to learn how to go about things. This thread can provide some help in that regard. They need to think, and that's the hardest work to do.

This thread, if I understand its purpose correctly, should be like the Karate Kid version of audio and we are Mr. Miyagi.

So...show them wax on, wax off.

Chris H

Silver Member

Username: Hawkbilly

Nova Scotia
Canada

Post Number: 171
Registered: Jul-07

Posted on Monday, March 17, 2008 - 08:06 am:

I have found that a lot of people who are really into audio are very good "analysts". Logical, if not always practical. Left brained, sometimes to a fault. I include myself in this description. The irony in this is that music of course is not left brained, or logical. It is art, beauty, whimsy, emotion, fun, passion, or sadness. I was very lucky in my youth, having been exposed to music in number of different ways. I played piano for a time, played oboe in a concert band, alto sax in a jazz band, and even played sax in a military band. After a long hiatus during the raising of four children, I rediscovered music, and not long after, my stereo. I've also reengaged the musician in me, having started playing guitar not long ago when my daughter took it up.

My understanding of music, what I like, and what it means to me is anchored in those early experiences. Although I typically will start any evaluation of how my stereo "sounds" or how some component in a showroom "sounds" with my usual analyst hat on, I try to catch myself and try to hear through the characteristics of the components and connect with the music. Nothing can snap me out of this any quicker than something that sounds completely wrong....whether it's a horn, a cymbal, a piano, etc. But once you've put together something that gets most things mostly right, most of the time, it is far easier to stay inside a musical performance without the rude interruptions (unless the kids are fighting). I have found that listening for the music first, and then if something strikes me as wrong, engage my logical side to try to determine what, works best as a process. If I try listening with my left brain, it is easy to miss the music.

I have also found it very helpful to read a great deal, to gain an understanding of my goals with regards to hi fi. Some may wonder how that helps, since everyone evaluates and enjoys audio differently. What I have found is that it helps me understand what I have already heard. Something that seemed right, or didn't seem right that I couldn't explain or articulate at the time. Being armed with that understanding has helped me tremendously understand what I am likely to enjoy, and what I am likely not going to enjoy as much. Reading has also saved me a lot of money. If you know what you are looking for, there are more options out there than you may think. If you get rid of your biases you may find yourself getting better sound for far less money that you thought possible.

I've certainly learned a thing or two from the folks here.

Neil Waterman

Silver Member

Username: Jazzman71

Phoenix, AZ
USA

Post Number: 106
Registered: Dec-07

Posted on Tuesday, March 18, 2008 - 01:53 am:

Nice post, Chris.

I find myself in retrospect having some similarities with you -- school band (clarinet), guitar player, very particular about a system's ability to "get it right" although I am still unable to articulate it very well.

The past two months has been an awakening for me in terms of audio. I am going back and really enjoying my music. Before starting to build my system, I started to get back into guitar in more than a casual way about three years ago, and I think that started me again appreciating the sound of live music and high quality audio.

And I have found the advice here on this forum to be very helpful.

Too often, people are looking for a quick solution, or just want to buy something without really analyzing what they like, what their needs are or where they want to take their system. They get frustrated with posts that respond by inquiring why they are leaning the way they are, or suggesting that they take a different approach.

I have been helped much more by what folks here have talked me out of, than what they have talked me into. I am never put off by someone that says "I cannot tell you what to do, but I can tell you what not to do." I am very interested in that because it saves me thousands of dollars and gets me to a much better, more satisfying system with far less frustration.

Gold Member

Username: Mike3

Wylie, Tx
USA

Post Number: 1194
Registered: May-06

Posted on Sunday, March 23, 2008 - 02:41 am:

Neil and Chris, nice contributions.

I have been trying for some time to figure out how to contribute to this post in a meaningful manner. JV has been most helpful with the associated links provided, as have others with their posts previous.

I got into “Hi-Fi” or so I thought because I wanted to hear music for different reasons than most. I can go listen to live music, but too often it is cover bands or small clubs without a good reference for what works.

I have gone to symphonies and concerts as have most of us here. I have heard engineered studio recordings and “Live” recordings of artists too numerous to remember.

Lately “Live” music works for me if it is non-amplified. Otherwise it can be a matter of what the “venue” or sound technician is coloring. Maybe it matches my paradigm, maybe it doesn’t.

This oration excludes venues where amplification is not used. I listen chiefly to amplified music. So it is nearly impossible to determine what sounds right. Don’t get me wrong I have heard B.B. King and Muddy Waters in small setting Chicago night clubs, Chicago in concert at the original Arie Crown theater, several Orchestras, Jazz live in New Orleans, and piano bar singers making me swoon. All of these opportunities were impressionable on me.

Where I find my reference or “comfort” of how something sounds dates back to listening to how my Grandfather’s system played music. Some tuner, mostly albums is what he played. Philco turntable with Jensen speakers via tube amplification, mono, all self contained with tuner in his console.

I once went on this Quixotic venture about 20 years ago to find the limit in a system to where I could no longer hear a difference if a better component was added. When I gave it up I think I was up to a single disc CD player with separate pre-amp and amp and could still discern differences at ~$10K worth of gear. At the time I had a Fisher receiver, Pioneer speakers, a Garrard TT, and a Sony Beta-max for a quasi reel to reel recorder. Technics was my choice for cassette recorder. I never truly enjoyed it other than it was better than what my friends and family had.

My goal was to find a system I could enjoy, that would provide me at the same time the comfort of hearing something now as I heard it back when I was a little kid, yet give the chills when I hear a guitar riff or drum sequence as if I was the beneficiary of a private concert.

This post is about why I bought my kit, what I was looking for and such. It is not about my kit, or the evolution of my kit. I will get to that in time.

To me it starts with having a sense of where you want to go with what you want your system to do for you. Mostly, listen to live music is the bible to learning what you should expect from your system. I happened to have a Grandfather who had a wonderful appreciation for music and my understanding of what sounds good was developed a long, long, time ago.

My point being is it has to sound right to you, it is your money you are investing, do what works for you. Just figure out what that is before you start spending your money.

Neil Waterman

Silver Member

Username: Jazzman71

Phoenix, AZ
USA

Post Number: 116
Registered: Dec-07

Posted on Sunday, March 23, 2008 - 02:11 pm:

"Lately “Live” music works for me if it is non-amplified. Otherwise it can be a matter of what the “venue” or sound technician is coloring. Maybe it matches my paradigm, maybe it doesn’t."

Very true. Attending an amplified concert where all elements click is somewhat rare for me these days. I find some of the newer venues are horrendous. One thing I find myself doing before popping for the tickets is thinking critically about the venue. I cannot control the sound technician, but I can pass if it's a lousy venue for live music.

Gold Member

Username: Mike3

Wylie, Tx
USA

Post Number: 1242
Registered: May-06

Posted on Sunday, April 13, 2008 - 02:34 am:

Early into the experiment.

It is late, I need to respect those asleep and play at low levels.

Yet tonight is doesn't sound like low levels beyond the quietness of the volume.

That is a result of JV offering to me the option of working with fiberglass bass traps, DIY version, in my listening room. I have done more than most of you would consider and due to that have really improved what my kit can deliver. Most of you have seen my kit on various other posts. Well, we have another "tweak".

Betcha' most of you would not even try this.

I have taken fiberglass, 13 batt, and rolled it up and stacked it up in the front corners of my room. I first removed the portable office cube panels that I thought could help with bass.

Results were immediate and profound.

Many songs are like I have never heard them before. I am listening, due to the hour, Elvis, Feist, Missy Higgins, Willie.

Sweet!

There is no way to convey in a single post the satisfaction achieved with a simple room change. (OK, maybe not so simple to all as my wife thinks my room is now a bio-hazard of sorts.)

M.R.

Gold Member

Username: My_rantz

Australia

Post Number: 1906
Registered: Nov-05

Posted on Sunday, April 13, 2008 - 10:51 pm:

Betcha' most of you would not even try this.

Yep!

A lot of us don't have a big boy's room Mike. Here you go again, giving the girls more eye rolling material.

Art

Gold Member

Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon
USA

Post Number: 6689
Registered: Feb-05

Posted on Sunday, April 13, 2008 - 10:57 pm:

Most of us won't try it as our listening spaces are our living spaces as well.

Stu Pitt

Gold Member

Username: Stu_pitt

Irvington, New York
USA

Post Number: 2632
Registered: May-05

Posted on Sunday, April 13, 2008 - 11:11 pm:

"OK, maybe not so simple to all as my wife thinks my room is now a bio-hazard of sorts."

Do you actually expect us to believe she didn't think it was "a biohazard of sorts" a long time ago? I haven't seen it personally, but a picture is worth a 1,000 words.

If I ever make it down to Wiley or Dallas, I definitely have to drop by. Any Division I colleges in Big D? My only Texas experience was A&M in College Station.

Gold Member

Username: Mike3

Wylie, Tx
USA

Post Number: 1246
Registered: May-06

Posted on Monday, April 14, 2008 - 08:59 pm:

With all due respect I think I can get this to the point where it could be appealing. Once I know I am done messing with the various things I am doing. I think that time, while not at hand, is getting near.

There are some things I cannot hide, like speaker wires, and mine do not withdraw into the crowd if you know what I mean.

My speakers are much further into the room than most of you too from the pics you have shared. So that may still be viewed negatively.

But the bottom line is I invested in my system to enjoy it to its fullest and doing the things I am doing is getting me closer to that realization.

I do understand the need compromise when utilizing a shared space, but to me that means further creativity is required to achieve some of these things.

I could go out and spend about $300 - $400 each for "real" isolation or dampening shelves, or $600 each for ASC tubes, (OK, I cannot go out and spend almost $3K on room treatments) but why should I even consider that when I can do all of this for a little less than $100.

Does it work as good as $3K worth of treatment? Some yes, mostly no, but my sound is a heck of a lot better than it was before my latest segue into "taming" my room.

The middle "bass trap" is shielded with a cotton sheet. I did not want to risk a bio-hazard event with my MAC.

Stu, UT Dallas is here. That is the only one I am aware of.