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Thread: Experience with Vincent Audio? |
    
New member Username: Hamrick
Post Number: 4
Registered: Sep-07
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| Posted on Friday, November 09, 2007 - 04:39 pm: |
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Hello everybody, does anybody have any experience/knowledge involving the Vincent Audio equipment that Audio Advisor has recently added? In particular the tube/solid hybrid amps. |
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Platinum Member Username: Jan_b_vigne
Dallas,
TX
Post Number: 11709
Registered: May-04
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| Posted on Friday, November 09, 2007 - 05:14 pm: |
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The Absolute Sound did a very good review of the amp either last month or the month before. Claimed it was the best the reviewer had heard beneath $1k. |
Silver Member Username: Chicomoralessxm
Dutch isles
Caribbean
Post Number: 199
Registered: Feb-07
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| Posted on Saturday, November 10, 2007 - 12:03 am: |
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I think Jan is refering to this review....
http://avguide.com/products/product-3959/
Vincent products look like they are designed in Germany but built in china. what new. Nonetheless so regards their sound quality quite highly, if at all possible go listen. I was looking at the preamp also reviewed their. |
Silver Member Username: Chicomoralessxm
Dutch isles
Caribbean
Post Number: 200
Registered: Feb-07
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| Posted on Saturday, November 10, 2007 - 12:11 am: |
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Jan just wondering do you know anything about Odyssey audio? I was wondering how vincent Sp-331 would compare to a modded khatago amp from klaus? |
Platinum Member Username: Jan_b_vigne
Dallas,
TX
Post Number: 11713
Registered: May-04
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| Posted on Saturday, November 10, 2007 - 09:31 am: |
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Sorry, don't know the Odyssey line. That was the review I read where the power amp was claimed to be the best under $1k. There was another Vincent review of an integrated, possibly in Stereophile, which also gave the unit high marks for its price range. TAS also just reviewed a Dussun integrated which garnered nice comments.
The problem I find here is most decent gear can get a decent review. Unless it throws up capacitors on the reviewer's carpet, there are probably good things to be said. The issue is not finding the "best" piece of equipment but finding the piece of equipment that suits your needs. Do not get hung up on a year long chase for the best product at any price. Listen to a few items and make your selection. Then take it home and live with it while you listen to music. There will always be something better or different and, if you become paralyzed by indecision, you will waste your time thinking rather than listening.
The Vincent reviews make the line sound like a very decent entry into high end audio. I'm sure there are others that might serve your purpose but if you like the Vincent, give it a try. Better to be listening in your home than reading about what you could buy. The Vincent should provide a reference for what budget audio gear can achieve. With it in your home as a basis for comparison, reading other reviews will make more sense.
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Silver Member Username: Wattsssup
Barrie,
ON
Canada
Post Number: 128
Registered: Aug-06
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| Posted on Saturday, November 10, 2007 - 09:58 am: |
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Excellent advice. |
Gold Member Username: Nuck
Post Number: 9148
Registered: Dec-04
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| Posted on Saturday, November 10, 2007 - 10:09 am: |
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Be in good standing with the dealer and put it into your space and listen.
Yup, good advise.
It beats listening to that clock radio while pondering. |
Silver Member Username: Chicomoralessxm
Dutch isles
Caribbean
Post Number: 201
Registered: Feb-07
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| Posted on Tuesday, November 13, 2007 - 03:20 am: |
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Very good advice! I've already bought some new bookshelves can't weight to hear how they sound....the opera mezza's. Now its time for the electronics. The more i think of it the outlaw 2150 sound like the way 2 go for my budget. Their are lots of deals on audiogon i know but personally i'd just rather spend the extra dollars and buy new or maybe i have a inert sense to support dealers lol. anyway i need to save up a bit and who know i might just take a chance with a vincent preamp instead........or creek int amp.......or a CA...awww man just to many choices.  it makes it fun |
New member Username: Zoney99
Post Number: 4
Registered: Nov-07
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| Posted on Tuesday, November 13, 2007 - 11:38 pm: |
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I apologize in advance for sounding like such a dumbass but here it is anyway:
I simply cannot get by a high-end piece of equipment named Outlaw.
"Yup, I got this here power amp its the Outlaw and while I put this chew a tobacca in my mouth it's gonna warm up some and we're gonna put on some Waylon Jenning!" No, I'm sorry, no Outlaw for this law abiding citizen! Nice company, dum non-audiophile name. |
Platinum Member Username: Jan_b_vigne
Dallas,
TX
Post Number: 11731
Registered: May-04
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| Posted on Tuesday, November 13, 2007 - 11:47 pm: |
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Like "Dodge" isn't a dumb name for a car. |
New member Username: Zoney99
Post Number: 7
Registered: Nov-07
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| Posted on Friday, November 16, 2007 - 09:45 pm: |
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LOL - Dodge. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I mean, is Krell beautiful? McIntosh? Mac Mini? AR 2AX? JBL Century? Some names mean more to me than others. Each decides. Say "Krell" to 99% of the public and they're like, yeah, I drink milk when I eat a krell. Outlaw - seems like a decent company and if you are less shallow then me (most people are) you won't think twice. |
New member Username: Zoney99
Post Number: 8
Registered: Nov-07
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| Posted on Friday, November 16, 2007 - 09:49 pm: |
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BTW several years ago I bought from Audio Advisor (pre-internet) and I was quite happy with them. In fact the Totem Acoustic Ones that I use for monitors I bought from them. I still receive their catalog and I am not real impressed with the lines they carry or their pricing. I would def shop around before making a purchase decision. I have also seen the "Vincents" and being a vintage motorcycle buff it sparked some interest..........but I'm not too sure I'd jump into that pool without testing the waters (at a brick and mortar dealer) first. |
Platinum Member Username: Jan_b_vigne
Dallas,
TX
Post Number: 11744
Registered: May-04
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| Posted on Friday, November 16, 2007 - 09:56 pm: |
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I believe AA is the only Vincent outlet in the North American market. |
Silver Member Username: Chicomoralessxm
Dutch isles
Caribbean
Post Number: 202
Registered: Feb-07
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| Posted on Friday, November 16, 2007 - 11:57 pm: |
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Are you meaning online? Jan, i believe Audiowavehifi in Cali are also dealers and they a have better pricing. |
Platinum Member Username: Jan_b_vigne
Dallas,
TX
Post Number: 11745
Registered: May-04
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| Posted on Saturday, November 17, 2007 - 08:04 am: |
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I thought the review in TAS stated Vincent's only N.A. dealer as AA. Once again, chico, I'm willing to admit I don't know how many dealers Vincent has by now. This world moves too fast for me sometimes. |
Silver Member Username: Unbridled_id
Chicago
Usa
Post Number: 208
Registered: Mar-04
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| Posted on Saturday, November 17, 2007 - 07:40 pm: |
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Very nice looking gear. I was told by a guy at audio advisor that if a unit needed service it had to be sent to their distributor in Michigan. This is what made me think twice about purchasing the 331 amp. The 6n16 tubes (I have only seen them used in Vincent gear) are not user removable, and this I see as a negative. Because one cannot swap tubes and though I am not a tube person I know those who are like Jan would like this to be an option. Second, I don't want to ship it out simply to replace a tube, I know I can screw in a lightbulb. Why make the tubes so they cannot be replaced by the owner? |
Silver Member Username: Unbridled_id
Chicago
Usa
Post Number: 209
Registered: Mar-04
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| Posted on Sunday, November 18, 2007 - 09:35 am: |
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In addition they also measure the amps distortion using single-frequency power (Total harmonic distortion: < 0.1 % max. (1 kHz, 1 Watt)). As opposed to measuring at any frequency within human audibility (full audible bandwidth of 20Hz-20kHz).
Now I cannot say this will result in an audible difference that would cause me to not buy the unit.
I don't know if I have the hearing to find this as being an issue but I would prefer something other than the FTC's minimal requirement. |
Platinum Member Username: Jan_b_vigne
Dallas,
TX
Post Number: 11757
Registered: May-04
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| Posted on Sunday, November 18, 2007 - 07:47 pm: |
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Why? What exactly does 0.01% T.H.D. tell you? |
Silver Member Username: Unbridled_id
Chicago
Usa
Post Number: 210
Registered: Mar-04
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| Posted on Sunday, November 18, 2007 - 09:12 pm: |
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Well what .1% T.H.D tells me is that compared to some other amps there is more distortion. It also tells me that that figure is arrived at using one frequency 1 khz and one level of output 1 watt, nothing more and nothing less. Like I stated, whether or not this would be audible to me or not I do not know. Feel free to enlighten me Jan as I have much to learn and you much to teach. |
Platinum Member Username: Jan_b_vigne
Dallas,
TX
Post Number: 11763
Registered: May-04
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| Posted on Monday, November 19, 2007 - 09:22 am: |
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A few quick points. First, T.H.D. specs are measuring one of the more innocuous forms of distortion an amplifier can produce - usually. I.M. distortion is typically considered more offensive since its product is not directly related to the signal content. While I.M. distortion must be quoted by Federal Law, it is usually not emphasized and never becomes a source of pride for most maufacturers.
Second, T.H.D. specs do not indicate the make up of that gross distortion number. An amplifier producing higher amounts of lower order second harmonic distortion will be less bothersome than an amplifier producing lower amounts of higher order harmonic content. Odd order harmonics are generally considered more bothersome since they have no direct relationship to the signal content of music while even order harmonics are more benign since they occur naturally in the source. While high T.H.D. specs might rule out an amplifier for someone, others would gladly take the tube amplifier with the 1% T.H.D. spec over the transistor amplifier at 0.1%. because of the musicality of the tube amp which produces primarily second order and even order harmonic distortion. All things being equal - which they never are - the lower T.H.D. spec is still just an on paper number. Good circuit design and implementation should produce good results.
Third, the T.H.D. spec quoted tells you nothing about how the designer arrived at those numbers. Negative feedback is a simple and cost effective (cheap) way to lower the on paper spec. A bit of N.F.B. makes any amplifier, other than a single ended triode, sound "better". Mostly because it tends to make the amplifier more stable into a resistive load and will assist the amplifier in maintaining a flat frequency response. Overdo N.F.B., however, as many receiver manufacturers often do, and the amplifier becomes far less stable into a reactive load while the T.H.D. spec continues to fall when the amp is measured into a resistive load. Raising N.F.B. also tends to increase I.M. distortion and - what some consider far more relevant to music listening - the T.I.M. distortion.
Finally, for now, your speakers operate at about 10-20% T.H.D. at low frequencies and higher volumes. Your amplifier's T.H.D. spec makes for a very small amount of additional distortion at most levels. However, the speaker generates primarily even order harmonics. If the amplifier is producing high order (third, fifth, seventh, etc.), odd order harmonics, the results of the amplifier's contribution will still be quite audible to anyone sensitive to such problems.
It still comes down to not having sufficient information when looking at typical on paper specs and deciding which specs are relevant to the decision making process. As I've said before, with on paper specs, the most important (generally stated) specs to consider are height, width and depth along with the weight.
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Silver Member Username: Unbridled_id
Chicago
Usa
Post Number: 211
Registered: Mar-04
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| Posted on Monday, November 19, 2007 - 11:38 am: |
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Thank you Jan, as they say you don't listen to specs. |
Silver Member Username: Nmytree
Post Number: 141
Registered: Aug-04
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| Posted on Tuesday, November 27, 2007 - 05:32 pm: |
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I have the Vincent Audio SA-T1 Hybrid Tube Pre Amp. I love it!
Later tonight I'm going to be posting some audio gear p*rn, featuring the SA-T1 in all it's revealing glory. if you're interested, take a look. |
Silver Member Username: Nmytree
Post Number: 145
Registered: Aug-04
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| Posted on Wednesday, November 28, 2007 - 05:29 pm: |
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The SAT1 pics are in the "Pre Amp" section. |
Gold Member Username: T_bomb25
Dayton,
Ohio
United States
Post Number: 1591
Registered: Jun-05
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| Posted on Thursday, December 06, 2007 - 10:41 am: |
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The Vincent gear is fantastic for the price,they have good stuff,just google they have a number of dealers in the US,they have that old school house sound like the older classic Mac gear. |
Silver Member Username: Chicomoralessxm
Dutch isles
Caribbean
Post Number: 209
Registered: Feb-07
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| Posted on Thursday, December 06, 2007 - 10:19 pm: |
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audiowaveshifi.com. They have good prices on Vincent stuff and free shipping as well. Sure if your located in cali you can arrange a demo. |
