| Author |
Thread: Speaker caps |
    
Bronze Member Username: Occam
Post Number: 59
Registered: Jul-05
|
| Posted on Friday, August 05, 2005 - 08:05 pm: |
|
Should I ever consider replacing the caps in my speakers? |
|
|
|
Gold Member Username: Petergalbraith
Rimouski,
Quebec
Canada
Post Number: 1112
Registered: Feb-04
|
| Posted on Friday, August 05, 2005 - 08:08 pm: |
|
How old are they?
I'm told I just replace mine, and I'm planning to spend about US$100 doing that, but the speakers are 27 and 32 years old... |
Silver Member Username: Devils_advocate
Post Number: 143
Registered: Jul-05
|
| Posted on Friday, August 05, 2005 - 08:20 pm: |
|
That sounds like some old speakers there Peter. You should upgrade to newer models! |
Gold Member Username: Petergalbraith
Rimouski,
Quebec
Canada
Post Number: 1115
Registered: Feb-04
|
| Posted on Friday, August 05, 2005 - 08:33 pm: |
|
They still make 'em DA... They still make 'em.
:-) |
Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigne
Dallas,
TX
Post Number: 4860
Registered: May-04
|
| Posted on Friday, August 05, 2005 - 09:22 pm: |
|
"Should I ever consider replacing the caps in my speakers?"
Yes, but only for a fleeting moment. There are far more serious issues to consider.
Why do you think you should consider replacing the caps in your speakers?
|
Gold Member Username: Petergalbraith
Rimouski,
Quebec
Canada
Post Number: 1118
Registered: Feb-04
|
| Posted on Friday, August 05, 2005 - 09:38 pm: |
|
Depends on the age Jan. I've hear that refreshing old caps and upgrading crossovers lead to much bigger sound changes than spending thoudsands on separates.
I'm looking forward to trying this myself ("You mean it gets even better?") |
Silver Member Username: Devils_advocate
Post Number: 146
Registered: Jul-05
|
| Posted on Friday, August 05, 2005 - 09:44 pm: |
|
I was able to replace the caps (among other things) on my speakers with some assistance and am pleased by the results, but I suppose YMMV. |
Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigne
Dallas,
TX
Post Number: 4871
Registered: May-04
|
| Posted on Friday, August 05, 2005 - 10:47 pm: |
|
Well, neil keeps asking this same question and apparently not liking any of the responses he has received.
http://forum.ecoustics.com/bbs/messages/1/151031.html
I'm getting curious as to why he wants to change things around.
|
Gold Member Username: Petergalbraith
Rimouski,
Quebec
Canada
Post Number: 1129
Registered: Feb-04
|
| Posted on Friday, August 05, 2005 - 10:55 pm: |
|
Ah, I hadn't made the connection... |
Gold Member Username: Kegger
Warren,
MICHIGAN
Post Number: 2571
Registered: Dec-03
|
| Posted on Friday, August 05, 2005 - 11:27 pm: |
|
I build and rebuild speakers all the time and have for quite some time now.
I hear people saying they changed there xover parts "caps and whatnot" and now
the sound is just glorious, so much more open and the crispness in the tweeter.
Yes this definatly can happen and does but be careful of what you wish for.
most "good" speakers have fairly good parts inside and if they are kept in use
the passive parts rarely "need" changing. The original designer more then likely
used the parts they used to "voice" the speaker and if you change those parts
to something else you are now altering the "voice" of the speaker, this is not
nescasarily a bad thing but you may introduce things into the speaker that you
didn't realize like phase/frequecy overlap and just plain the EQ of the speaker.
Yes you may get lucky and improve the speaker but you may also ruin what the
speaker did right. Also if you have a system that was riding the edge of being to
bright and now you "opened up" the tweeter by replacing the old oil caps with the
new polys you may have ruined how nice the top end sounded to your ears for
extended listening sessions. Same goes for the resistors in the xover many have
been chosen for there sound and what they do to a particular driver that if you
change them yah it can change the sound but did it truly improve it or is it just
that it's different.
I'm not saying you can't change them and don't experiment but not every "good"
part is good in every situation. Just because many people think poly caps are
better then there older oil cap cousins doesn't mean they will be right for your
speakers with your other accosiated gear.
I particulary like oil caps "be it new or old" and then new wirewound resistors to
be a good fit with each other for most of the speakers I've worked with. this is
just a guideline I go by and have had to alter it when needed or wanted.
Now if you have some cheap/inexpensive speakers then yes there xovers more
then likely are not up to snuff along with the parts used and building a new xover
with quality parts will probably make a very positive change. |
Bronze Member Username: Occam
Post Number: 61
Registered: Jul-05
|
| Posted on Friday, August 05, 2005 - 11:57 pm: |
|
The reason I asked about the speaker caps is that I am looking at some older speakers. Noting that there are caps in the amplifier which Jan said might need replacing I then focused on the speakers. My post concerning crossovers was back when I was just starting to research crossovers.
I am usually quite satisfied with the answers I get on this board. |
Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigne
Dallas,
TX
Post Number: 4875
Registered: May-04
|
| Posted on Saturday, August 06, 2005 - 12:18 am: |
|
Unless the speaker has been driven hard constantly, the caps in a X-over don't get the heat and cool cycles that capacitors in electronics, especially power amps, will be subjected to. Heat and cool cycles are what wear the most on passive parts.
|
Bronze Member Username: Frostyda9
Calgary,
AB
Canada
Post Number: 24
Registered: May-05
|
| Posted on Saturday, August 06, 2005 - 03:53 am: |
|
KEGGER what are your thoughts on wirewound resistors? I've noticed that generally ceramic style resistors are found on cheaper systems, and wirewound ones on pricier speakers. I would assume the crossover network would see either one as a resistive load of the same value, but is there some other electric property that makes the wirewound resistor more desirable? |
Gold Member Username: Kegger
Warren,
MICHIGAN
Post Number: 2573
Registered: Dec-03
|
| Posted on Saturday, August 06, 2005 - 09:21 am: |
|
Sound! Generally anything other than a good wirewound resistor will induce a
sonic character and for the most part it will be a steally or grainy one so most
if not all good xovers will use a good quality wirewound piece.
Now there are some places in a xover that are not in the signal path to a driver
and those places you can get away with using some other not the greatest parts
like electrolitic caps/matel core inductors and non wirewound resistors.
Some designers will still use the expensive parts in these positions to but I
reallly don't see the need. Who knows maybe the return path back to the amp likes them.
But I dought it very much though!
Anyway those have been my experiences with a lot of testing plus trial and error! |
Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigne
Dallas,
TX
Post Number: 4883
Registered: May-04
|
| Posted on Saturday, August 06, 2005 - 12:31 pm: |
|
Before anyone starts yanking the parts out of their X-overs, I would remind everyone that all passive components have a mixture of capacitance, inductance and resistance. When you begin replacing parts without a known value for the resistance of an iron core inductor, you could be changing the calculations made in the original X-over design that affect more than just the inductance of the circuit. When dealing with the larger values on inductors used in speaker X-overs, it is very difficult, if not impossible, to merely substitute an air core inductor for an iron core unit. You will affect another part of the overall X-over design. Quite possibly in a less than desirable fashion.
The same holds true for carbon vs. wire wound resistors and to a lesser extent paper vs. foil caps. Additionally, in a well matched pair of speakers, the factory probably used a capacitance bridge to get the closest pairing of individual components; here resistors could be matched to better than 1% tolerances. If you begin to replace caps and resistors without knowing how closely the new pieces match each other in value, you could once again change a product that was well designed into a hack job. In some cases this even applies to the internal wiring of the speakers which might have been chosen for the sonic (and R,C,L) values it contributes to the overall system rather than just price.
Look before you leap.
|
